In the market for a 6.2 e63 estate..... Not many out there?

[st13phil]

If you want the M156 power unit, then go for it.

Performance out of the box is inferior to the M157, fuel consumption higher, more power is harder and more expensive to extract, and you miss out on various detail improvements that happened through the lifecycle of the W/S212 platform. Other than that, it’s clearly the better option.

 

[damurphster]

So my (potentially incorrect) counter to those points are:

Performance = negligibly different, certainly in the 'more than enough' territory

Fuel consumption = LPG gives you an honest overall 30%+ reduction in fuel costs, so for me, the 6.2 would likely work out cheaper (although I would have to take account of the cost of moving my kit)

More power harder & more expensive to extract = agree. Although I'm a bit worried about more power from the 5.5 - are you down to frightening mpg and lunching gearboxes etc? If I went 5.5 I'm not sure I would take the risk of more than 550bhp. Happy to be educated here.

Various detail improvements: what are these? Not seen any mention of them?

My big concern is the complexity of the 5.5 over the 6.2, I'll be running this as an older car, likely as a long termer doing a fair amount of miles.

I'm currently about 70% 6.2 Vs 30% 5.5!!

There are more 5.5 out there as well so likely easier to find one with a decent spec and price. The white 5.5 one above has all the toys I'm looking for (except LSD, which I could add)

 

[Skd884]

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[st13phil]

Performance = negligibly different, certainly in the 'more than enough' territory

Fuel consumption = LPG gives you an honest overall 30%+ reduction in fuel costs, so for me, the 6.2 would likely work out cheaper (although I would have to take account of the cost of moving my kit)

I accept that you have an unusual use case with respect to LPG, so I understand why you're minded to go for the NA engine. The improvement in fuel economy of the Biturbo engine over the NA engine in real world driving is probably around 15% - 20%, so that will help you work out the break-even point regarding moving the installation to a new (to you) car.

While the outright performance against a clock is similar, it is accessed completely differently. The forced induction engine pulls hard whatever engine speed, while the NA engine has to be "driven" (i.e. revved) to access the performance. I'm fortunate enough to have had a Biturbo E63 and my wife's R172 SLK55 with the NA version of the same 5.5 litre engine to be able to drive back-to-back, and in my view the forced induction engine suits the character of the E-Class much better than an engine that has to be driven at the top end of its rev range to achieve the same thrust. And before anyone says "the M152 isn't the same as the M156", I know it isn't, but the power delivery is similar and by the time the NA engine has scurried down the gearbox and wound itself up, the forced induction powered car will be long down the road.

Various detail improvements: what are these? Not seen any mention of them?

Obvious changes are improvements to the functionality of the Driving Assistance systems and COMAND, while others are more subtle. For example the front door window lifts really struggled on many pre-2012 cars in cold weather. My 2011 E350CDI suffered this, and it was resolved by the fitting of thinner window glass and revised window channels while under warranty but there will be many cars that did not have the warranty work done. My point is that all models evolve during their production run, with detail improvements that are often hidden but add up to a better product overall.

My big concern is the complexity of the 5.5 over the 6.2, I'll be running this as an older car, likely as a long termer doing a fair amount of miles.

Just remember that while the engine may be the heart of the car, there's an awful lot more to consider than just the engine. My honest belief (based on ownership experience) is that the later cars are a better proposition - especially if you can run to an early facelift - but that doesn't mean an early NA car is automatically a bad choice.

 

[AMGeed]

^ All very salient points Phil, but it's hard to convince anyone that one particular engine is superior to another when their minds are 99% made beforehand.

The true test can only be a test drive in both, which I understand can be hard to achieve. But it ca bediscussed until you are blue in the face and will just divide fans of both engines.

From my limited experience, I have found that with each incarnation of Mercedes V8 engines, the new one is better than the one previous (M113K excepting) Forget the exhaust note, go on perfomance, and the engines speak for themselves.

For one particular poster who is all over the forum with his love of the M156 and his blind refusal to see that there might just be something better out there, here is some food for thought. (BTW, the video title is misleading. There are 5 defects)

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[esscee]

That video could help someone's decision making!

 

[350cls]

Buy the 5.5 bi-turbo the 6.2 is absolutely shite. Honestly it's totally crap it shouldn't be listed under an AMG engine. I mean no other AMG engine has troubles whatsoever to this extent.

Is this OP actually really for real to buy a car as I think he's an 5.5 bi-turbo owner in disguise.

I cant honestly see the trouble in getting a test drive in a vehicle that one was set on buying !!!!!

 

[350cls]

I mean the 0 to 60 times are like so wide aren't they.

Performance you say

 

[350cls]

Exhaust note I say

 

[jonboyE63]

For what it's worth, I run a 2012 5.5 E63 & it's wicked.....thought about the C63 but didn't want the NA V8 - what's not to like with a V8 Bi-Turbo...??
The car is 100% standard & is chuffing epic (in my humble opinion) it goes like stink, will return 25+mpg on a 80mph run & looks the nuts....
I didn't worry about it breaking down - it had a years warranty when I bought it & that covered the couple of niggles it had, other than fuel & oil it's not cost a penny for the last 12 months & 12,000 miles - I think you'd need to seriously rinse it 24/7 to worry about breaking anything...
Test drive both & then buy the 5.5...

 

[damurphster]

So update to this......still nothing i'm interested in on the market. There is basically 2 6.2 E63 on the market but neither have the massage/cooled seats which I'm keen on.

I've never seen such a slow market for a car.

Being patient but its killing me.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

So update to this......still nothing i'm interested in on the market. There is basically 2 6.2 E63 on the market but neither have the massage/cooled seats which I'm keen on.

I've never seen such a slow market for a car.

Being patient but its killing me.

Compromise on the seats and get one bought!

 

[AMGeed]

^ Agree. You'll be waiting forever.
You have to compromise sometimes.

 

[Abb]

Compromise on the seats and get one bought!

And the following day. one will turn up which ticks all your boxes (or does that only happen to the likes of me!

 

[Deleted member 37751]

And the following day. one will turn up which ticks all your boxes

....and cheaper..!

 

[MrRight]

So update to this......still nothing i'm interested in on the market. There is basically 2 6.2 E63 on the market but neither have the massage/cooled seats which I'm keen on.

I've never seen such a slow market for a car.

Being patient but its killing me.

I feel your pain. I was looking at 6.2 E63 cars and there isnt many at all out there. The estate is uber rare. the saloon one I found had 50k miles, and the heated , cooled , massaging seats but no sunroof . I'm not overly fussed about that as the condition of the car exterior and interior is mint. I'm hoping to arrange a pre purchase inspection prior to collecting. I did notice a good estate for sale that was hugely tempting too but the saloon was a few k cheaper so I effectively ignored the more desirable estate (I'm a huge estate fan) and went for the cheap option as i dont need the extra practicality . fingers crossed something else comes on to the market asap

There are at least a couple saloons with great mileage though one is brown.

 

[StringfellowHawke]

Is it exclusively the w212 you are looking for? I say this as I bought a w211 e63 albeit the saloon last year and have not been disappointed. I would of also considered the estate if the right one came up but as has already been said they are not a ten a penny car like buying a fiesta. Granted the tech might be slightly older in the w211 and it also has a standard torque converter auto opposed to the mct of the w212 but it still has the 6.3 m156 which if like me you just want to experience, you buy the engine and get a free car with it! Anyway just a thought that might increase your options a little as I believe they only did the w212 m156 for a year or two before swapping to the m157. I also think I read somewhere there was only 140 odd w211 e63s total (saloon and estates) sold in the UK in the 3 years in production so not a massive pool to choose from either.

 

[350cls]

Is it exclusively the w212 you are looking for? I say this as I bought a w211 e63 albeit the saloon last year and have not been disappointed. I would of also considered the estate if the right one came up but as has already been said they are not a ten a penny car like buying a fiesta. Granted the tech might be slightly older in the w211 and it also has a standard torque converter auto opposed to the mct of the w212 but it still has the 6.3 m156 which if like me you just want to experience, you buy the engine and get a free car with it! Anyway just a thought that might increase your options a little as I believe they only did the w212 m156 for a year or two before swapping to the m157. I also think I read somewhere there was only 140 odd w211 e63s total (saloon and estates) sold in the UK in the 3 years in production so not a massive pool to choose from either.

Was you not aware your not allowed to like or want to experience or share your views on the mighty M156 on this forum. It's regarded as the poor man's AMG.

But if you want to experience the M157 then your regarded as one of the crowd. And many members will like your posts.

But I'll give you some advice don't talk up the 156 to much as it gets up some 157 members noses.

 

[E55BOF]

Was you not aware your not allowed to like or want to experience or share your views on the mighty M156 on this forum. It's regarded as the poor man's AMG.

It isn't.

But if you want to experience the M157 then your regarded as one of the crowd. And many members will like your posts. But I'll give you some advice don't talk up the 156 to much as it gets up some 157 members noses.

This is a very, er, individual viewpoint, posted by the individual in question.

The 156 is a good engine; the 157 is a good engine; neither is as bombproof as the 113K (also a good engine). None of the three will disappoint in the real world, and anything with any of them in is still faster than the vast majority of cars out there. If you must have gas, then the 156 is the only choice. Good luck in your search.

 

[DavidL]

I'd want those 2 things on a spec sheet really but having got them on my e55 purely by chance, I didn't know what to look for when I bought it, the cooled seats don't really do much and the massage/inflatable bolsters are amusing briefly but I never use them.
You won't miss them in real life but, like you, there will be those who absolutely want them when you are selling, but then won't use them.