MB Service gone wrong - spark plug snapped!

[Will]

to be honest, they won the negotiation

You've walked away with a spoiler you didn't want and a couple of free services which they can let the apprentice do and stamp your book for you.

They however have got away with a solution that will cost them next to nothing and for a nice low price have placated a customer that was haggling for a new car

Andy's correct there - a new tailgate + painting + fitting would have cost them more than two services which will realistically only stand them in the cost of the parts at trade (and on a brand new car, I expect will consist of little more than an oil change and some filters). £50-100 or so perhaps?

Good result for all involved if you weren't too worried about the spoiler (sounds as though you weren't), but I am fairly sure that a new tailgate could easily have been fitted and matched fine

Edit to add - what would you do if someone bumped the car and a new tailgate was needed? I'm not sure you can insist on a new car every time!

 

[andy_k]

But they played their hand the wrong way.

They might see it differently, after all, who's got a spoiler that he didn't want

 

[LTD]

Andy / Will / Jay

The resolve was that the dealership ended up agreeing to the resolve the customer deemed acceptable rather than them steam-rollering the customer at the first port of call.

That resolve was more beneficial to me than the initial offer.

Had I really have been ****** off - I would have had a new car.

The reason for that is the unaswerable question to all of their claims that their resolve would be acceptable.

That question is "Why should I accept it ? Why?"

 

[Bellow]

Will, I think your attitude is completely out of kilter with the initial concerns of the OP. All initial signs pointed to a kack handed mechanic. And consequently the concerns regarding a bodged repair that could easily have led to an unsellable car were absolutely valid ( bore scored with debris, burning oil = MOT fail and zero resale value).
Yes we all make mistakes - and pay for them. We, or I certainly, don't expect to pay for the mistakes of others.
I think that was the general consensus of this thread, and also the OP was grateful for the contributions as it gave him the confidence to approach the garage and get the fair result he achieved.
If I am wrong, let the OP come forth and tell me so.

 

[Will]

Yes - point fully understood. But I don't see the point in speculating that the garage are likely to 'bodge' the engine - I see no evidence to support that. After all, they've been honest and admitted the issue from the beginning, they're not being sneaky about anything.

No one has suggested the the OP pays for any mistakes.

At the end of the day, the fault wasn't serious, irrepairable or suggested to be bodged. MB admitted liabliity instantly and agreed to a full F.O.C repair.

All this nonsense about scored bores and marking the head with centre punches sounds like kids play and not that of reasonable adults IMHO.

Life's too short to lose sleep over stuff like this.

 

[Bellow]

No one has suggested the the OP pays for any mistakes.

At the end of the day, the fault wasn't serious, irrepairable or suggested to be bodged. MB admitted liabliity instantly and agreed to a full F.O.C repair.

All this nonsense about scored bores and marking the head with centre punches sounds like kids play and not that of reasonable adults IMHO.

Life's too short to lose sleep over stuff like this.

The OPs original concerns were valid. He was anxious to avoid paying (in the longer term, and in less tangible terms) which could easily have transpired.
He was asking before the dealer showed themselves to be on the case. They admitted liability, but rectification was far from decided.

The initial reports of broken porcelain if unretrieved would almost certainly have scored the bore - be in no doubt of that.

Maybe you don't lose sleep over your mothers otherwise sound car being potentially wrecked by those professing capability, but the OP was certainly correct in being concerned.

It is very easy to come in at the end of a thread asking what all the fuss was about. But at the time the concerns were real, and the rigour with which they were dealt with was, I am certain, of help to the OP in achieving his outcome.
As stated earlier, if I am wrong, let the OP correct me.

 

[trapperjohn]

Great post Bellow, sums up my take on this beautifully.

The OP came on with 5 posts in the bank and having read the forum looking at what "stealers" can get up to ......... He asked for advice and got it in shed loads.
It's a great forum this and the OP had loads of information and facts to go in with armed to the SM. That is all he ever asked for.

I think really "well done" forum for speedily helping the OP out.

 

[Will]

The OPs original concerns were valid. He was anxious to avoid paying (in the longer term, and in less tangible terms) which could easily have transpired.
He was asking before the dealer showed themselves to be on the case. They admitted liability, but rectification was far from decided.

The initial reports of broken porcelain if unretrieved would almost certainly have scored the bore - be in no doubt of that.

Maybe you don't lose sleep over your mothers otherwise sound car being potentially wrecked by those professing capability, but the OP was certainly correct in being concerned.

It is very easy to come in at the end of a thread asking what all the fuss was about. But at the time the concerns were real, and the rigour with which they were dealt with was, I am certain, of help to the OP in achieving his outcome.
As stated earlier, if I am wrong, let the OP correct me.

Nope - read the first post again. We are talking about a Mercedes-Benz main dealer here - not a garage under the arches who might not be there next week.

Fact - they admitted the issue right from the beginning
Fact - they immediately agreed to repair the car and F.O.C
Fact - there is no suggestion that they are to bodge the repair

All of this scaremongering and unfounded suggestion that they are to bodge the repair is ridiculous. It doesn't need six pages of posts to realise that. Why do you think that the bore is to be scored - don't you think that they know how engines work? What makes you think that they are likely to perform a sub-standard repair?

I'd be all up for criticising them if the response to the situation had been unsatisfactory, but given the circumstances, what more could they do?

 

[Bellow]

Hi folks,

would like to get your thoughts and whether I need to worry!

My mother has recently bought an A170SE Auto on a 55 plate (W169) and was due a service. Booked the service at the local MB dealer (had a bad experience with local indy on my own car thought I'd play safe and go with dealer).

Just shy of £500, service includes, service A, brake fluid, combi filter, air filter, atf oil and filter, spark plugs and rear brake pads (is this a reasonable quote for an a-class?)

Got a call the morning I was supposed to pick up the car, saying while fitting one of the spark plugs it snapped off! he said the spark plug got cross threaded and the top of the spark plug is made of porcelain and is easily breakable! He said they've tried some tools to get it out but has failed and they will have to take the whole engine out and strip it down to get at it from the inside!

Is there anything I need to worry about as it sounds like a quite complicated job and they're opening up the engine - will they be causing any short or long term damage that will affect the life of the engine?

Is spark plugs breaking just one of those things that happen now and again to all good mechanics or is it a cowboy mistake? To my mind if its just like a screw that goes in at the wrong angle and you get cross threading you meet resistance very quickly and so you back out and try again. Only if you've lost your mind would you try and carry on and force the thing in - is this a correct analogy?

would welcome your thoughts on this issue,

Thanks,
Swift.

Well will. There it is, the original post in entirety.
Now, 2 questions for you.
1) Where does it say they will meet the repair costs? Because all I can see there is a statement of the requirement to strip the engine, not who will foot the bill.
2) Why did you wait until the 5th page before talking up - like someone turning up offering help when all the heavy lifting has already been done?

 

[LTD]

Got a call the morning I was supposed to pick up the car, saying while fitting one of the spark plugs it snapped off! he said the spark plug got cross threaded and the top of the spark plug is made of porcelain and is easily breakable! He said they've tried some tools to get it out but has failed and they will have to take the whole engine out and strip it down to get at it from the inside!

The lack of response to the OP's enquiries and this quote certainly makes you think twice about the job in hand and the concerns.

Let's be clear here.

Which of us are end-users and which of us are on the tools for a living ?

Opinions may differ.

 

[Will]

Well will. There it is, the original post in entirety.
Now, 2 questions for you.
1) Where does it say they will meet the repair costs? Because all I can see there is a statement of the requirement to strip the engine, not who will foot the bill.
2) Why did you wait until the 5th page before talking up - like someone turning up offering help when all the heavy lifting has already been done?

1) Where does it suggest that the OP is to billed for the work? I see no mention of that, just an admission of fault from MB?

2) I didn't see or read this thread until this afternoon/early evening, I was out last night.

What's your excuse for scaremongering and suggesting that the dealer is to perform a substandard repair?

I'm not silly, believe me. I just find it crazy that after six pages on this thread, people are still arguing and implying that some sort of poor quality repair was likely and that the engine would be ruined afterwards.

Nothing personal, but I do feel that the OP was led to believe that MB would probably be bodging the repair, and that didn't appear to be the case. Why cast aspersions until we know the outcome?

 

[andy_k]

Andy / Will / Jay

The resolve was that the dealership ended up agreeing to the resolve the customer deemed acceptable rather than them steam-rollering the customer at the first port of call.

That resolve was more beneficial to me than the initial offer.

Had I really have been ****** off - I would have had a new car.

The reason for that is the unaswerable question to all of their claims that their resolve would be acceptable.

That question is "Why should I accept it ? Why?"

You can argue as much as you like that you have won but (IMHO) you have gained so little but potentially lost so much.

I'd rather have the dealership on my side than wishing they didn't have me as a customer

How popular and how much goodwill do you think you now have at that dealership?

Will the service manager be pleased to see you next time you take your car in?

Will the dealer principle greet you with open arms and will you be at the top or the bottom of the list when they have any freebies to give away?

If there's a rush job that comes in when your car is in the workshop who's car is going to get bumped to the back of the queue?

and finally, at the risk of labouring the point.....Who's got a spoiler he didn't want?

 

[LTD]

How popular and how much goodwill do you think you now have at that dealership?

Don't go there. Don't care.

 

[Bellow]

1) Where does it suggest that the OP is to billed for the work? I see no mention of that, just an admission of fault from MB?

2) I didn't see or read this thread until this afternoon/early evening, I was out last night.

What's your excuse for scaremongering and suggesting that the dealer is to perform a substandard repair?

I'm not silly, believe me. I just find it crazy that after six pages on this thread, people are still arguing and implying that some sort of poor quality repair was likely and that the engine would be ruined afterwards.

Nothing personal, but I do feel that the OP was led to believe that MB would probably be bodging the repair, and that didn't appear to be the case. Why cast aspersions until we know the outcome?

OK, you weren't around when this was live. Of course it reads differently afterwards.

I do not accept the accusation of scaremongering against me. And I don't believe it is valid for other posters either.

Incidentally, at no point in those early posts was there an admission to financial culpability from the dealer.

What actually happened was the posters reacted to the clearly expressed concerns of the OP. Now while some posts may have veered towards overkill, that is far from untypical for a forum thread. In engineering terms we would call the system underdamped. With a tendency to overshoot before arriving at its final resting position.

But (at least) two positive things occured.
Firstly the OP found his rest position - from which he progressed to his successful outcome.
And secondly, along the way, as in many a good internet forum thread, we learned things we didn't previously know.

Why you find that so wasteful I do not understand. Six pages yes, but we are only re-arranging electrons. No trees were cut down, no one died.

For me though, it is dragging this further now that the issue is resolved that is crazy.
As intimated earlier by trapperjohn, this thread has been a wonderful example of the democratising power of the internet.
While opinions differed, none but you Will questioned the validity of the thread.

That's all (from me) folks. Goodnight y'all.

 

[Will]

The way I saw it, the OP (a newbie) posted a thread due to his concerns and limited knowledge of engines/repair methods.

He stated that MB were being completely open and honest about the situation, and they intended to repair it.

Rather than re-assuring said member, many people jumped to the conclusion that MB would for some reason bodge his car and he'd be left with a ruined engine.

I don't see how all the scaremongering contributed to a positive outcome?

There's no mis-understanding on my part

 

[swift1]

Guys,

I would like to thank and praise everybody here for all their useful and knowledgeable contributions.

You have given me the knowledge and confidence to ask detailed questions to the SM, for which I was simply in no position to do the first time the SM told me about this problem and I am very grateful for.

Your posts have enabled me to get the reassurances I needed the remedy would be safe and will not have an adverse effect in the long-term. Along with giving me an insight into the thread repair: helicoil and time-sert.

With the exception of a few minor mishaps, I do have to praise the SM as he has honestly, patiently and professionally answered all my questions without any BS and also in the way they are dealing with and rectifying the problem. The SM himself is a former tech and seems very knowledgeable.

I think within a dealership you can get very good and very bad people. When I first rang the dealership to get a quote for the service, the person I spoke to (not the SM but an after sales support), very much insisted that I needed both a Combi filter and a Dust filter along with a fuel filter and a B service. However, when I later rang parts to get a parts price list (as I wanted to see how much the price difference would be from an indy), he said you only need a combi or a dust filter and not both, and you don't need to replace the fuel filter on an a-class as they are an integral lifetime part. This completely knocked my confidence in the dealer, if they can't even get my quote right what on earth is the service going to be like or more likely just change the appropriate filter and charge me for both!. However, after much deliberation and my overwhelming bad experience with a local indy and at a cost of £200 more, I bit my lip and went with the dealer.

They are still putting the car back together, they say it will be ready for Tuesday morning. I will post back on how it all goes.

This forum is an absolute great resource and a godsend for all us newbies.

Thanks all,
Swift.

 

[iscaboy]

I think within a dealership you can get very good and very bad people.

This is a problem with all larger operations, the chain is only as strong as the weakest link, and unless you make it clear that you are a customer that never wants to be anywhere near a weak link, that's what you'll get.

An independent garage usually only has one or two links, if you get a good one, you're golden.

For anyone with an older car anywhere near Exeter, I cannot recommend the following highly enough.
SNOW & STEPHENS Garage - Exeters Local Specialist in Classic & Performance Cars

 

[johnsco]

This forum is an absolute great resource and a godsend for all us newbies.

Thanks all,
Swift.

This forum is a great resource and a godsend for all of us.
I've been an avid DIY motor-enthusiast for 45 years and I still have SO MUCH to learn.

I can only pay tribute to all on this forum who share their knowledge and expertise so generously.

Cheers.
Johnsco

 

[swift1]

Hi All,

Picked up the car this afternoon, they didn't have the letter ready so he went of to write one there and then. The letter does say that the spark plug snapped in cylinder 2 and the head had to be removed and sent to a specialist, that the thread was completely unaffected and has not been helicoiled or repaired in anyway. The head gasket and the repair carry a 2year unlimited mileage guarantee. A guarantee that should there be any problem with this thread when the next spark plug change is due in 4yrs time. A parts invoice for the head gasket was supplied (£36.17).

Unfortunately and disappointingly, they did not offer a discount or goodwill on the bill, instead saying that I had already got a good deal on the price Reflecting back I was way too passive and wish I had been more assertive and argued just how inconvenient and troublesome the whole saga had been.

When the SM drove the car round to the front, it was making an awful whining sound (it used to make a slight whining sound before but this seemed significantly more pronounced). Even the SM noticed it and said that the poly-v belt just needs some talc! He took the car back in and 5 mins later came back out and the whining sound had gone! He said it is quite a common problem and a trick of the trade is to put some talcum powder on the belt - He said they keep a bottle of johnsons baby powder for just such occasions! I don't know if people on the forum already knew that, but hopefully, this might help out a few people who have the whining sound on their car.

For the people wanting to know which dealer it was, all I will say is that myth has it Robin Hood used to live here.

Hopefully that's my mums car sorted and hopefully the next service should be a simple oil and filter job and much lighter on the wallet!

Thanks again for all your help and support,
Swift.

 

[jaymanek]

you need a new belt, the whining will come back soon!