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What would you do to restore Mercedes reputation as a ‘Premium’ manufacturer?

Do you remember vinyl roofs?

The day my wife got her brand new Seat Cordoba, in 1996, she reversed over a kerb pulling off a front mudflap. This had been screwed to the edege of the front wing. The result was two jagged holes.

These two holes were still there twelve years later when she changed cars...they had not got worse. Given that the car was pre 2000, the above statement regarding pre 2000 Mercedes seems a little hollow since I doubt any Mercedes of the era would have survived such an incident without terminal rust of said wing over the following 12 years.
pre2000is i agree vague, in my piece i was contrasting the w124 eclass with the eclass which replaced it in circa 1998 ,my own 1991 w124 E300d was 20 years old when i bought it and had 250000 miles on the clock , no rust on body or chassis. mechanically sound and has been reliable. I did say that the 1998 on new e class were rust buckets i.e. very prone to rust.This was due to changes in spraying protocols and GREENER solvents.also use of thinner lower grade steel in body pannels part of the cost savings .[ 20% cheaper to manufacture than the previous W124. i have a 1998 skoda felicia 1.9 D which i use as a city .these are great durable but basic cars. skoda first car under VW ownership was the felicia ,seat cordoba ?did VW own seat in 1996? VW,s were and are good cars.
 
I suspect that the growth of the company car market in many european countries has lead to a diminution in quality/longevity of many prestige brands--why worry if the car only lasts 3-5 years if -- 1. you didn't pay for it and 2. you will get a new one in 3 years anyway!
https://www.transportenvironment.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/2020_10_Company_cars_briefing.pdf

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Interesting stuff , mercedes introduced the baby merc the 190 to attract the fleet mar ket ,the first 3 series BMW was amassive sucess as a fleet car and eventually overtook Ford in fleet sales!
 
I’m not thinking of any particular member when I say this, but I do sense a touch of oneupmanship in some posts in this thread and others like it.

I’m very proud of my Mercedes-Benz ForFour AMG Black Series, but I suspect some members would look down on me because it dilutes the brand.
Nil carborundum illegitimi. Bobby D.
 
Not as Premium as perhaps once was, as Mercedes are now accessible to a lot more people (which personally I think is a good thing) for them and the Company, have to say though, I still feel a tad special driving me Merc. :cool: :) 👍
 
Not as Premium as perhaps once was, as Mercedes are now accessible to a lot more people (which personally I think is a good thing) for them and the Company, have to say though, I still feel a tad special driving me Merc. :cool: :) 👍
+1
 
Not as Premium as perhaps once was, as Mercedes are now accessible to a lot more people (which personally I think is a good thing) for them and the Company, have to say though, I still feel a tad special driving me Merc. :cool: :) 👍
They have always been accessible - just depended on how old a car and with how much mileage you were prepared to drive. ;) A bigger range means that they have simply broadened their customer base.
 
They have always been accessible - just depended on how old a car and with how much mileage you were prepared to drive. ;) A bigger range means that they have simply broadened their customer base.
I was mostly referring to Brand new car's, Rory,
but your are correct, take my car for example, it was £46,000 new with the extras fitted, no way on earth I could afford that. But when I bought it 3 and a
half years ago, it was a Third of the price new, great! for me. :) 👍
 
I think we shouldn't confuse premium with luxury.

My recollection of MB from the 60s and 70s is that they built rock solid cars that were very reliable, and could be run for decades.

But not all their cars were made for Dictators and Plutocrats. MB also made large quantities of some rather basic models, including the 190 that was replaced by the 220 (in 1969, from memory) and later by the 240, available also with a 4-pot NA Diesel engine, with minimal spec and seats covered in durable plastic (MB-Tex). In those days they were certainly premium cars... better-engineered and better-built than the rest. But there was nothing luxurious about them.

These cars served as taxis in Europe, then found their way to Africa and the Middle East where they were repaired over and over again for many years and many hundreds of thousands of miles.

MB no longer make cars that are a cut above the rest in terms of engineering, build quality, and durability. Instead, they make cars that can be described, at best, as above average.

Is there a space in the market - or indeed a need - for a mass-produced 'premium' car brand? It's questionable.

Over the years we have replaced many of the solid-built durable expensive goods for cheaper ones, and cars are no different.

For example, in the past wealthy people bought top-brand watched because it was a solid economic proposition to pay more for a watch that will last them for a lifetime and that they will then leave to their children. These days expensive watches are bought for very many reasons, but the above is rarely one of them.

So, would you pay more these days for a solid-built new car that will last for 30 years....?
 
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I think we shouldn't confuse premium with luxury

My recollection of MB from the 60s and 70s is that they built rock solid cars that were very reliable, and could be run for decades.

But not all their cars were made for Dictators and Plutocrars. MB also made large quantities of some rather basic models, including the 190 that was replaced by the 220 (in 1969, from memory) and later by the 240, available also with a 4-pot NA Diesel engine, with minimal spec and seats coveted in durable plastic (MB-Tex). In those days they were certainly premium cars... better-engineered and better-built than the rest. But there was nothing luxurious about them.

These cars served as taxis in Europe, then found their way to Africa and the Middle East where they were repaired over and over again for many years and many hundreds of thousands of miles.

MB no longer make cars that are a cut above the rest in terms of engineering, build quality, and durability. Instead, they make cars that can be described, at best, as above average.

Is there a space in the market - or indeed a need - for a mass-produced 'premium' car brand? It's questionable.

Over the years we have replaced many of the solid-built durable expensive goods for cheaper ones, and cars are no different.

For example, in the past wealthy people bought top-brand watched because it was a solid economic proposition to pay more for a watch that will last them for a lifetime and that they will then leave to their children. These days expensive watches are bought for very many reasons, but the above is rarely one of them.

So, would you pay more these days for a solid-built new car that will last for 30 years....?
My Dad left me a gold Rolex, accidentally also a lovely old 5 series and a less lovely but still in use Mitsubishi Lancer.

There might be a moral somewhere but I’m buggered if I can find it.
 
My Dad left me a gold Rolex, accidentally also a lovely old 5 series and a less lovely but still in use Mitsubishi Lancer.

There might be a moral somewhere but I’m buggered if I can find it.

Sorry for your loss, and more so if it's a recent one.

Perhpas there is a moral here though... which of the three will still likely be in use in (say) 30 years time?
 
................

These cars served as taxis in Europe, then found their way to Africa and the Middle East where they were repaired over and over again for many years and many hundreds of thousands of miles.

..........
I think the Peugeot was the car that dominated in Africa in the 60’s, 70’s & 80s. I grew up in SA but worked and travelled all over Africa and before the Japanese cars started getting better Peugeots were everywhere.
 
I think the Peugeot was the car that dominated in Africa in the 60’s, 70’s & 80s. I grew up in SA but worked and travelled all over Africa and before the Japanese cars started getting better Peugeots were everywhere.

True. The 403 was the precursor, it peaked with the 404, and the 504 also had good following.

There were also quite a few FIATs, not the most durable of cars (ahmmm....) but apparently cheap to run and fix.

Mercedes didn't dominate these markets obviously, due to the higher initial cost, but it was definitely one of those cars that you'd see still going strong at 30 years old.
 
Interesting stuff , mercedes introduced the baby merc the 190 to attract the fleet mar ket ,the first 3 series BMW was amassive sucess as a fleet car and eventually overtook Ford in fleet sales!
Was talking to leather car seat restorer. he was saying he was repairing damage to seats in mercedes less than 12 months oldand that mercedes is use vinyl as a fake lleather in some vehicles. Incredible or what. he also said that warranties didnot cover damage because mercedes warranties do not cover wear and tear.What an absolute shambles. mercedes ? a prestige marque today?
 
Was talking to leather car seat restorer. he was saying he was repairing damage to seats in mercedes less than 12 months oldand that mercedes is use vinyl as a fake lleather in some vehicles. Incredible or what. he also said that warranties didnot cover damage because mercedes warranties do not cover wear and tear.What an absolute shambles. mercedes ? a prestige marque today?
Can’t damage happen to a seat in any car?

PS Mercedes call the “fake” leather Artico man made leather. It’s in a lot of cars and most owners wouldn’t realise. It’s clearly called “man made leather” in the sales information though so the original purchaser is not mislead.
 
True. The 403 was the precursor, it peaked with the 404, and the 504 also had good following.

There were also quite a few FIATs, not the most durable of cars (ahmmm....) but apparently cheap to run and fix.

Mercedes didn't dominate these markets obviously, due to the higher initial cost, but it was definitely one of those cars that you'd see still going strong at 30 years old.
when my 1991 E300d was scrapped a lot of parts including engine and gearbox were shipped to Africa
Can’t damage happen to a seat in any car?

PS Mercedes call the “fake” leather Artico man made leather. It’s in a lot of cars and most owners wouldn’t realise. It’s clearly called “man made leather” in the sales information though so the original purchaser is not mislead.
Less than 12 months old? no warranty cover,wear and tear? MAN made LEATHER? most owners do not realise but they are not misled,if they do not realise how do you know they are not misled? who reads the small print anyway ' Bobby are you a Mercedes Salesman. No offence. Graeme.
 
when my 1991 E300d was scrapped a lot of parts including engine and gearbox were shipped to Africa

Less than 12 months old? no warranty cover,wear and tear? MAN made LEATHER? most owners do not realise but they are not misled,if they do not realise how do you know they are not misled? who reads the small print anyway ' Bobby are you a Mercedes Salesman. No offence. Graeme.
No I’m not a Mercedes-Benz Sales Person, and I wouldn’t take offence unless there’s something derogatory implied which I’m not aware of?

Damage can happen when the car is 12 months, 12 weeks, or 12 days old. Being relatively new doesn’t mean it can’t be damaged, natural leather damages more easily.

Even in cars with leather, the vast majority are coated to prepare it, which means that when you touch it, you’re touching a synthetic (man made) coating and not leather.

The man made nature of Artico is not in the small print it’s in the brochure and on the configurator - if someone buys a car without looking at those things it’s not important to them.

Because it’s made very clear in the brochure and online configurator, then it would be a push to suggest that the original purchase is misled.

Subsequent purchasers could be misled by the vendor - main dealer or otherwise - but it would be a push to suggest that they are then being misled by Mercedes-Benz.
 
Just got a 70 plate C Class from Enterprise via Tesco insurance as have a small non fault repair to the lower front of mine...The build quality is poor...the window buttons are all loose and falling off...The guy from Enterprise said all their new Mercs are the same even an £80K one...Mercedes told them its wear and tear...the one I have at the moment has done just over 1K miles
 

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