Bluetooth SAP adaptor / HTC Touch Dual

[alexbligh]

I have a new Mercedes Benz S Class with a Bluetooth SAP adaptor (appears to be part number A 204 820 05 35). Amongst the list of deficiencies with this car (see next post) would appear to be that I can't pair the Bluetooth.

The instructions suggest I should push button 6 (the merc symbol) for 2-3 seconds whereupon the blue lights should flash rapidly (they do). It then says I should to Call list Dialled - and confirm. It claims it will then show me a list of devices I can pair to. My device name comes up, and I confirm, as required. This shows me a 16 digit number (as it claims it will) for about 1.5 seconds before removing it. I'm pretty good at memorizing numbers but 1.5 seconds is not enough. If I follow the instructions for other vehicles, I find that the SMS menu has something similar there. However, this number is meant to pop up on my phone (and HTC Touch Dual, which whilst it's not on the list is just an HTC Touch with a keyboard, and is a standard Windows Mobile 6 device), and it does not. Nor can my phone see the SAP adaptor using "Add Device". I can try with a Nokia 8800 tomorrow (which is on the list) I suppose.

Any ideas?

 

[whitenemesis]

Surely with a new S-class (well, any new car) all this should have been demonstrated and explained to you by your dealer?

Does the HTC (windows mobile) support Sim Access Profile? I'm assuming the 16 digit numbe appeared in the COMAND display? Is your phone in discovery mode?

 

[alexbligh]

That would have been nice. The dealer arranged for delivery, and the delivery driver was from an independent firm.

Yes, the HTC Touch Dual supports SIM Access Profile (SAP), and yes I have Bluetooth turned on (!), and yes it's set to discovery mode (i.e. broadcasting its ID), and it certainly sees the ID, else it could not know the device ID of the phone! I've tried with and without authentication required, no difference. I can pair the phone successfully with other devices including the Mercedes Command Unit (which has a different Bluetooth unit in to pair headsets to and to transfer vCards, apparently), but not the Bluetooth puck.

 

[whitenemesis]

As you have Gazza already paired to the module perhaps you need to remove that one first. I know the unit will accept 4 phones but it just may be easier with a clean start?

 

[alexbligh]

Nope "Gazza" was paired to the internal command unit (not the bluetooth puck - there appear to be 2 independent BT systems). I removed the pairing (plus the pairing between the internal command unit and my phone, which worked) and it made no odds. I've also removed the BT puck, waited, and reinserted it in the hope that would reset it somehow.

 

[Diesel Benz]

I have difficulties following what is going on with the HTC device but I've been using even th V1 BT SAP puck successfully with a W221 (why would they have the product if it didn't work with any phone).

If you follow the BT puck guide and your phone guide, you should reach a state where you enter the 16 digit BT SAP pairing code. It works with my phone, better try with the Nokia 8800 as you seem to have that option and then try to reach the same with the HTC.

 

[alexbligh]

It works fine with the Nokia 8800. When I select calls dialled, the 16 digit number comes up. Calling that number (as per the manual) produces a pairing request on the phone. On the HTC this doesn't happen, it says "invalid number" and blanks the display. Any ideas?

 

[Diesel Benz]

It works fine with the Nokia 8800. When I select calls dialled, the 16 digit number comes up. Calling that number (as per the manual) produces a pairing request on the phone. On the HTC this doesn't happen, it says "invalid number" and blanks the display. Any ideas?

To me this sounds like the HTC still responds in a non-BT SAP mode. I would search for experience from other HTC phone users, I thought someone had been successful. Reading the phone manual again, would be another option.

 

[amwebby]

AFAIK the HTC does not have an SAP BT mode, which would explain its inability to pair with the SAP cradle.

 

[alexbligh]

Well, there is a program called SAPSettings, which has "Remote SIM Access" switched on, the help for which says "Enabling this option allows Remote SIM Access over Bluetooth". That suggests to me it has SAP, and is confirmed by lots of reviews saying it has SAP. The manual isn't right next to me, but...

 

[PXW]

I had a similar issue with my BT SAP 2.0 handset unit - my Samsung (non-SAP) wouldn't pair - behaving exactly as you describe. Once I tried it with a Nokia SAP phone it whizzed through without any problem. I don;t understand the built in BT on COMAND - it's there, you can pair to it but it doesn't seem to allow any functionality.

 

[alexbligh]

Allegedly the built in BT on Command allows you to (a) beam vCards to it (perhaps for Nav destinations, perhaps just phone numbers), and (b) pair a BT headset, so you can talk in privacy whilst still taking advantage of the external aerial. I have tried neither. What it definitely does not do is let you pair a phone for BT SAP or BT with Command itself acting as a headset.

 

[amwebby]

Well, there is a program called SAPSettings, which has "Remote SIM Access" switched on, the help for which says "Enabling this option allows Remote SIM Access over Bluetooth". That suggests to me it has SAP, and is confirmed by lots of reviews saying it has SAP. The manual isn't right next to me, but...

I stand corrected. However, Microsoft's BT implementations have never been the best. That, coupled with Mercedes BT implementation must be causing the behaviour you see. I'm sure there is a way to make the two talk to each other and I hope you find it. Have you searched for a Microsoft update?

 

[alexbligh]

I have done "Windows Update" on it without it making changes. (Bah, who would have thought a phone would have Windows Update). The phone is very new (both the physical phone and the range) with an October ROM date. I have not yet searched microsoft.com. I have asked HTC who say "ask Mercedes". I think I already know what Mercedes are going to say!

Yes, I suspect it's a stack interoperability problem of some sort.

 

[Diesel Benz]

Obviously from the menu reference and some phone tests the HTC should support SAP but I've seen a few posts with the same outcome. It is a bit odd if it does support SAP but nobody seems to be successful with it. Can't you approach the product manufacturer, perhaps via the seller?

 

[amwebby]

I'd be looking for a Windows or thrid party replacement for the Bluetooth stack in the HTC. I've not had one installation of Windows on my PC where the native BT stack doesn't cause problems and isn't better replaced with a 3rd party one, and I see no reason why Windows Mobile would be any different. It might be worth asking Mercedes for an alternative BT driver. They probably won't have one but they might know a man who does.

 

[davidjpowell]

I have a HTC Tytn and having read of problems on other forums with HTC / WM6 / Comand I bought the HFP Bluetooth adapter which works well. Not that much help to you though!

David

 

[prprandall51]

Probably not very helpful, but:

You could nip into a Volkswagen or a Bentley dealer - the Passat and all Bentleys also support SAP. You could try your phone in one of their showroom cars.

 

[richard]

Alex,
I cant remember if the S class head units support HFP without an adapter - if they do, i'd disconnect the SAP unit and try pairing with the headunit directly. If not, then when you're down near me, we can try an HFP unit. SAP is better as it uses car's antenna (very important if you have heat insulating (metal film) glass) and uses less battery - but not much cop if it doesnt work,

R

 

[Diesel Benz]

Alex,
I cant remember if the S class head units support HFP without an adapter - if they do, i'd disconnect the SAP unit and try pairing with the headunit directly. If not, then when you're down near me, we can try an HFP unit. SAP is better as it uses car's antenna (very important if you have heat insulating (metal film) glass) and uses less battery - but not much cop if it doesnt work,

R

No, the W221 does not support BT HF from the head unit, or it does but it is the "other way around", the HU connects to a BT HF headset. In addition it supports the profile for business card exchange, I think that is all.

Now that the W204 does, they should actually bring an update to this. The policy of "not phones in the cabin without the external antenna" has been lost in any case. Not that I would change from SAP to HF but as long as SAP has a limited phone selection, HF is needed anyway.