De-badging method

[dresho]

Sorry mate, but debadged, quad pipes? It is easy to see how some come to a conclusion that you are trying to dress it up as a C63.

As long as you enjoy it, go for your life!

S

???????? - how ? 1. my car hasn't got quads - you have seen my pics 2. Secondly if you observe my comments accurately we discussed both dual pipes as a poss mod and quad pipes as a poss mod and even a sports mod. dr nab has quad exhausts on his is his trying to be something else?? Mercedes offer and amg handling pack on the new sports plus with the larger brake pads etc similar to that of the c63? are they trying to dress it up as the c63?obviously not. The main point is just because people personalise there cars to the way they want them to be doesn't mean they are wanting to be something else. Accept your opinion that you feel some who debagde etc are wannabes but as for everything in life not everyone or everything can be tarred with the same brush - if i wanted my car to be something it be a bloody ferrari but that aint going to happen for a few years!

 

[MB-BTurbo]

Interesting, I wonder if I need to declare that mine has had badges put on? The original owner had the car debadged from factory and the dealer that sold it to me fitted the badges prior to placing the car for sale. So in effect my car has been modified from its factory spec?

Factory spec is with the badges on. If the original purchaser choses to take them off, even on the factory line then they should declare it. I have had a long discussion on this with insurance companies and insurance reps on other forums.

Insurance companies dont need much of an excuse to wriggle out of paying up and something as simple as debadging or upbadging can void your policy. In their eyes it makes the car more desirable and therefore infinitely more likely to be stolen

 

[Kid_Dav]

Factory spec is not with badges on at all. In the Coupe brochure there is even an option to h

 

[dresho]

He doesnt have quads does he?

Just a question to all those that debadge. Do you declare it as a mod on your insurance?

Its easy to ask me directly or look at the pics and see the answer to your question is no - and if a had a sports exhaust on /a dual exhaust/quad exhaust or leave it the same way as stated any changes are for personal taste and detailing - from changing a a idrive dial to the above.

With regards to the insurance in my case the company (mb insurance) said this wasn't a modification as i had pre selected this before the car was made and it was how i received the car - so they didn't register this as a modification on my insurance documents (unsure if thats the same in all cases)

 

[Kid_Dav]

Factory spec is not with badges on at all. In the C Coupe brochure there is even an action about badges for the buyer before the car is even manufactured. Like many others my car was delivered without badges :/. As for insurance purposes I have never heard of a de badge affecting policies. Again if my car was made without badges, supplied without badges surely this is not even a mod. Think some people are jumping on the de-badge as a way of thinking there car is better than another's rather than seeing it just like any other design preference.

 

[MB-BTurbo]

Its easy to ask me directly or look at the pics and see the answer to your question is no - and if a had a sports exhaust on /a dual exhaust/quad exhaust or leave it the same way as stated any changes are for personal taste and detailing - from changing a a idrive dial to the above.

Of course it would be easy to ask you if it was a genuine question that I was interested in finding out the answer to. I was asking what's called a rhetorical question, making more of a point than actually asking whether you had them or not.

With regards to the insurance in my case the company (mb insurance) said this wasn't a modification as i had pre selected this before the car was made and it was how i received the car - so they didn't register this as a modification on my insurance documents (unsure if thats the same in all cases)

I think this is the problem with car insurance. I have a rear spoiler that was fitted on the production line. My insurance says its a modification to original spec. I didnt even realise this until the day I picked it up and saw another that I thought looked bare without one, checked and discovered that I could have been driving around uninsured for a year. Under your insurance there would be no need to declare so how are people supposed to know whats what, especially 2nd or 3rd owner down the line?

I wonder how many people who have paid their insurance are blissfully unaware that they are not covered should the worse happen? You might be alright but my question was floated in general as there are more than a few companies that would see debadging as a mod. The fact that MBs come without badges is a peculiar situation as having the correct badges fitted could be argued as a mod as well.

 

[dresho]

Of course it would be easy to ask you if it was a genuine question that I was interested in finding out the answer to. I was asking what's called a rhetorical question, making more of a point than actually asking whether you had them or not.



I think this is the problem with car insurance. I have a rear spoiler that was fitted on the production line. My insurance says its a modification to original spec. I didnt even realise this until the day I picked it up and saw another that I thought looked bare without one, checked and discovered that I could have been driving around uninsured for a year. Under your insurance there would be no need to declare so how are people supposed to know whats what, especially 2nd or 3rd owner down the line?(with regards to just debadging - not any other mods eg spoiler/front lips that arent declared)

I wonder how many people who have paid their insurance are blissfully unaware that they are not covered should the worse happen? You might be alright but my question was floated in general as there are more than a few companies that would see debadging as a mod. The fact that MBs come without badges is a peculiar situation as having the correct badges fitted could be argued as a mod as well.

Can i ask the rear spoiler that you had done (which looks good) - was that an option that was in the catalouge in the spec for your car? or something you had negiotated for them to have done for you? because as kid dav mention in the c coupe spec there was a no cost option for the car to be made without the bagde - this was in all my paperwork as well as the factory tint etc and is in all the documentation including the finance break down - even that information forwarded to mb insurance. What size engine etc and type surely is in all your vehicle Log books, VIN and registration documentation which will precisely confirm to any other buyer down the line what you are purchasing regardless of what is advertised?

 

[MB-BTurbo]

Thanks. It was a factory fit option that was extra £££. Thats all I know as I am the second owner.
(can you actually see the spoiler? The pictures are so tiny)

I just ran a quote through gocompare. £515 for the B200 Turbo or £820 with the spoiler. What nonsense. How can a lump of plastic be worth an extra 60% of the cars premium?

 

[Alps]

This thread is such an overkill!

De-badging is a factory option so no im sure there will be no imsurance implications

mine had factory debadge but i re-badged it because it looked better! its alwaysa pain cleaning if it gets really dirty, just dont let it get too dirty!

personal taste, what a palava over a badge!

 

[dresho]

Thanks. It was a factory fit option that was extra £££. Thats all I know as I am the second owner.

I just ran a quote through gocompare. £515 for the B200 Turbo or £820 with the spoiler. What nonsense. How can a lump of plastic be worth an extra 60% of the cars premium?

Agreed but that may be the answer there - maybe because this was an option that you had to pay for at EXTRA COST? therefore increased the value of your vehicle - on the new sports plus the debagding is a no cost option and also the new sports spoiler can be deselected as a no cost option - i.e not increasing the value of the vehicle and no change in insurance cost. im guessing if i had more paid for factory options that had an extra cost eg HK and command - my total value of car would have risen and therefore my insurance premiums as these would be declared. feel free to correct me if im wrong

 

[BTB 500]

I just ran a quote through gocompare. £515 for the B200 Turbo or £820 with the spoiler. What nonsense. How can a lump of plastic be worth an extra 60% of the cars premium?

Because:

A) it may cost the insurance company more to repair if the car is damaged
B) it may increase the risk of theft by making the car look more desirable
C) there's almost certainly statistical evidence that owners of 'modified' cars are higher risk (by virtue of being more 'enthusiastic' drivers, or whatever)

I went through all this when I hd a VW Sharan V6 4Motion that had a (factory fitted, but optional) tailgate spoiler. It's the price you pay for a bit of individuality.

When I bought my SL (from a main dealer) I had no idea that the 17" wheels it had at the time were non-standard. When I found out I notified my insurers, who increased both the premium and the excess as a result.

 

[MB-BTurbo]

This is a minefield. I have all my 'blank' dash buttons filled in with what a assume are options but what was an option and what wasnt? If I have HK fitted on the factory line do I need to declare that? I thought it was due to it being the top model. I have tried my best to declare everything, down to a tiny metal badge on the drivers door and pay a right royal premium for it but to think there are other options that Im not even aware of and am in effect throwing money down the drain by invalidating my insurance is ludicrous. Surely common sense has got to prevail. If it was my Mother who bought the car she would have had no idea that the spoiler wasnt standard.

 

[MB-BTurbo]

Because:

A) it may cost the insurance company more to repair if the car is damaged
B) it may increase the risk of theft by making the car look more desirable
C) there's almost certainly statistical evidence that owners of 'modified' cars are higher risk (by virtue of being more 'enthusiastic' drivers, or whatever)

I went through all this when I hd a VW Sharan V6 4Motion that had a (factory fitted, but optional) tailgate spoiler. It's the price you pay for a bit of individuality.

When I bought my SL (from a main dealer) I had no idea that the 17" wheels it had at the time were non-standard. When I found out I notified my insurers, who increased both the premium and the excess as a result.

Non of those justify such percentage hikes. For example, my Impreza sport had been upgraded with everything the Turbo WRX has but it doesnt have the Turbo and isnt badged as such. It is therefore still a lot less powerful and less desirable. I was paying £200 more than if I had the full fat WRX in the first place. If I wanted to drive more enthusiastically I would have bought the WRX in the first place and it would have allowed me to have driven a lot quicker. I dont believe statistics come into it as there are some companies that like mods as they say that the owners take pride in their cars, are passionate about them and would take greater care of them.

 

[brucemillar]

Gents this has been discussed on this forum sooooo many times. You do not need to declare mods that you could not have known about or that have absolutely no impact on value or performance. So no badges is a no brainer.

I believe that the test case concerned somebody who bought a car with aftermarket wheels already fitted and insured it without declaring them. The judgement was that the insured could not be expected to be an expert on every aspect of origonal design.

 

[MB-BTurbo]

That sounds like common sense to me. If there was a claim I would expect the insurance companies to say that they would not cover the replacement that was an upgrade but to declare the whole claim invalid is unfair.

 

[BTB 500]

Non of those justify such percentage hikes. For example, my Impreza sport had been upgraded with everything the Turbo WRX has but it doesnt have the Turbo and isnt badged as such. It is therefore still a lot less powerful and less desirable. I was paying £200 more than if I had the full fat WRX in the first place.

That will be because statistically the owner of a modified lower-spec. car is more likley to be involved in an accident than someone driving a factory-stock car that has higher performance.

I dont believe statistics come into it as there are some companies that like mods as they say that the owners take pride in their cars, are passionate about them and would take greater care of them.

Of course statistics come into it - why do you think you have to declare your age, profession, how long you've been driving, how long resident in UK, etc.? These are all examples of factors that determine the risk associated with insuring you, which translates into the premium.

Read any internet forum (including this one) for examples of genuinely enthusiastic and passionate owners of cherished modified cars who still end up crashing them. Then factor in the tens of thousands of far less pampered modified cars that you see hooning around and you'll understand why there's a link between modifying and risk. Statistically. Some insurance companies want to make money (via higher premiums) from people the major insurers won't cover, hence the adverts you mention. You'll see others offering cover for previously convicted/banned drivers too - doesn't mean those are seen as plus points from an insurance POV.

 

[BTB 500]

If there was a claim I would expect the insurance companies to say that they would not cover the replacement that was an upgrade but to declare the whole claim invalid is unfair.

It invalidates the policy because that's what you agree to when you take it out. Read the declaration.

 

[MB-BTurbo]

That will be because statistically the owner of a modified lower-spec. car is more likley to be involved in an accident than someone driving a factory-stock car that has higher performance.



Of course statistics come into it - why do you think you have to declare your age, profession, how long you've been driving, how long resident in UK, etc.? These are all examples of factors that determine the risk associated with insuring you, which translates into the premium.

Read any internet forum (including this one) for examples of genuinely enthusiastic and passionate owners of cherished modified cars who still end up crashing them. Then factor in the tens of thousands of far less pampered modified cars that you see hooning around and you'll understand why there's a link between modifying and risk. Statistically. Some insurance companies want to make money (via higher premiums) from people the major insurers won't cover, hence the adverts you mention. You'll see others offering cover for previously convicted/banned drivers too - doesn't mean those are seen as plus points from an insurance POV.

Sorry, my post was badly written, I agree statistics is what a lot of premiums are based on but in this case it does sound as though statistics are not fairly used. For example there is nothing to descend between a subtle factory fit spoiler that enhances the look of the car from a full blown functioning boy racer Halfords special typically fired by those who hoon it everywhere they go.

 

[MB-BTurbo]

It invalidates the policy because that's what you agree to when you take it out. Read the declaration.

If thats the case I may as well not bother as I have no idea what actually was standard fit out of all the features my car has. I have a good idea and declare accordingly but can not say 100% I've not missed something trivial such as a gear knob upgrade or pedal covers. Mine are metal which I think we're standard.
What I am talking about are underlying statutory rights of the consumer that over rule terms and conditions and clauses that would be deemed as 'unfair' such as all mods of an insignificant nature that consumers havent a hope of knowing about.

 

[artyman]

Working on the basis that de-badging invalidates insurance would mean that hundreds of VW's would have been driving round uninsured a few years back when a pop group made a fashion out of VW badges, resulting in many a VW having it's bonnet badge removed. Obviously complete rubbish, badge or no badge would have no effect on a car. Now adding a performance chip or different brakes, suspension etc is a different matter.