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EU 'should ban inefficient cars'

Yet,...because production hasn't started and there is a 1 year waiting list.

You also can't get a lightning yet but you will be able to and that's 700Bhp equivelant with...err...zero local emmissions.

Hmm..I wonder if you could get a 400Bhp diesel to do 50mpg...probably.:rolleyes:

Only if it was fitted with a Quasiturbine engine modified to run on lard :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

For now I'll just stick with good old internal combustion & stick two fingers up to Sir Hypocrites comments........:p
 
Ignoring comments about diamond trading and such, what was the guy saying? That we have to be compelled to do something about carbon emissions (working from the premise of that is the right thing to do - let's not muddy the waters here...) because left to our own devices we all know what we need to do but will justify our own choices on the basis of need, convenience, bloodymindedness, etc, etc.

Notice that the headline jumped on his comments on cars. why not his comments on light bulbs, open market trading on carbon emissions, and building. Makes good headlines while deflecting attention away from the truth of what he's actually saying, which is something that most of us don't want to hear.

Had these comments been made by a carrot-munching, sandal-wearing, bike-riding enviro-greenie then just as many comments would have been made disparaging their credentials. We had some comments on a thread recently about "playing the man instead of the ball" - we all (and I include myself) sometimes need to look as the message rather than the messenger.
 
In the article I read on the subject, it was suggested that this ban should apply to NEW cars rather than old cars which will die of their own accord. On that basis, I think the aims have merit, however it is not exactly a radical/new idea now is it? Sounds like a headline grabbing attempt and has achieved it's aim.
 
I really need someone to explain to me how this action is the best way forward or even the easiest way forward. The world is going bonkers, it's okay to destroy milllions of acres of tree's in our rain forests or for this country to sell old, ineffeciant industrial machinery to third world contries that then build smokey old coal fired generators.

The Amazon Rainforest has been described as the "Lungs of our Planet" because it provides the essential environmental world service of continuously recycling carbon dioxide into oxygen. More than 20 percent of the world oxygen is produced in the Amazon Rainforest.


More than half of the world's estimated 10 million species of plants, animals and insects live in the tropical rainforests. One-fifth of the world's fresh water is in the Amazon Basin.


One hectare (2.47 acres) may contain over 750 types of trees and 1500 species of higher plants.


At least 80% of the developed world's diet originated in the tropical rainforest. Its bountiful gifts to the world include fruits like avocados, coconuts, figs, oranges, lemons, grapefruit, bananas, guavas, pineapples, mangos and tomatoes; vegetables including corn, potatoes, rice, winter squash and yams; spices like black pepper, cayenne, chocolate, cinnamon, cloves, ginger, sugar cane, tumeric, coffee and vanilla and nuts including Brazil nuts and cashews.
 
Are they also going to stop people thrashing their 35mpg cars, so that they only give 25mpg (like their V8's used to).

I wish I could honestly say this was a tongue in cheek remark, but sadly with our nanny state this seems a real possibility. Can't help thinking that George Orwell was right, just out by 30 years.
 
Sir Mark said that we don't NEED a car that does 10-15 mpg - he's perfectly correct none of us need cars like that nor do we NEED 400 bhp.

What people want is very different from their needs :)

Sometimes we forget and get the two words mixed up

Andy

My 2.5year old nephew DOES NEED one and he NEEDS ME to buy him one NOW.

Be assured, he when he says he needs it, he needs it!!!!!


Mind you he lives 500+miles from me so I don't really care if he needs one or if he intends to cry all night about it!
Sis-in-law announced this afternoon, that Brother has applied for a job in Oban. I have booked the first seat to Mars in retaliation, sorry, response to this timely fact that my family has decided to move close to UncleBag!
 
Well, I almost qualify :)
Driven gently, and I mean very gently!!!! I can squeeze 32mpg out of my E500 so surely with a more intelligent remap of the ECU it could potentially do 35mpg. A fact which clearly makes a mockery of his statement, Sir Mark I mean. We all know the manufacturers map their engines to produce low emissions at tickover so they can pass the MOT but in the midrange this is not the case. How many people drive around on tickover?
Surely what he meant to say was "cars which never do less than 35mpg".
Let's be honest, we all know how economically we can drive our cars, an E270 will do well over 50 MPG driven the same way but in the real world of congestion, inflexible employers insisting everyone commence work at 09.00 and clock off at 17.30, crappy public transport, ridiculous consumer prices on most essential items (housing, fuel, council tax, and food ain't getting any cheaper either) we all do the commute averaging well below the optimum mpg figures for our cars.
Then there's the fuel quality as well. If this Shell and BP premium fuel is so bleedin good and gives more MPG then why is it not compulsory to only sell that grade? This ex-shell bloke needs a good seeing to. If they are so concerned then let's see the colour of their money.
I escaped the ratrace to an extent changing jobs to an employer who actively encourages homeworking. My fuel bill went from £500 a month to about £180. My wife has also started working from home 2 days a week as well saving a commute into central birmingham at a cost of £20 a day roundtrip (parking included). The strange thing is, when we enquired about a season ticket for the trains, we cannot have a 3/5ths season ticket so we end up paying for 2 days she doesn't use. Another fine reason not to use public transport then. Open day returns cost more than the petrol and parking put together. Her car, despite being a pit is still way cleaner than the train, it is reliable and she doesn't have to sit on a grotty seat full of someone else's beer farts.
No, we don't need cars which do 35 mpg, what we need is a sensible all round approach to the problemS - yes, plural, there is more than one problem here.
Get the motorways running again, let's have some proper control on the railways, e.g. more carriages during rush hour and lets actively encourage the shops to stock the more lightly travelled foodstuffs. That might get some wagons off the roads.
Oh and as a final stab at our communist overlords, where the hell are the government laboratories which do all the research into more efficient fuels, engines, public transport, flexible working for those who are able, decentralising the production of food, etc etc??? And I mean scientists doing scientific research, not some idiot with a degree in sociology sitting on some quango.
Nope, until I see some joined up thinking being applied I, for one, am not going to buy a car simply because it fits said idiot's template. And nor will I use that filthy, overpriced, run down system they call public transport either. Latest price for open return from Tamworth to Euston - £131.00 and that's STANDARD CLASS!!! So, £262 for the Mrs and me to go to London for the day. Cheaper to hire a limo ;)
 
Well, I almost qualify :)
Driven gently, and I mean very gently!!!! I can squeeze 32mpg out of my E500 so surely with a more intelligent remap of the ECU it could potentially do 35mpg. A fact which clearly makes a mockery of his statement, Sir Mark I mean. We all know the manufacturers map their engines to produce low emissions at tickover so they can pass the MOT but in the midrange this is not the case. How many people drive around on tickover?
Surely what he meant to say was "cars which never do less than 35mpg".
Let's be honest, we all know how economically we can drive our cars, an E270 will do well over 50 MPG driven the same way but in the real world of congestion, inflexible employers insisting everyone commence work at 09.00 and clock off at 17.30, crappy public transport, ridiculous consumer prices on most essential items (housing, fuel, council tax, and food ain't getting any cheaper either) we all do the commute averaging well below the optimum mpg figures for our cars.
Then there's the fuel quality as well. If this Shell and BP premium fuel is so bleedin good and gives more MPG then why is it not compulsory to only sell that grade? This ex-shell bloke needs a good seeing to. If they are so concerned then let's see the colour of their money.
I escaped the ratrace to an extent changing jobs to an employer who actively encourages homeworking. My fuel bill went from £500 a month to about £180. My wife has also started working from home 2 days a week as well saving a commute into central birmingham at a cost of £20 a day roundtrip (parking included). The strange thing is, when we enquired about a season ticket for the trains, we cannot have a 3/5ths season ticket so we end up paying for 2 days she doesn't use. Another fine reason not to use public transport then. Open day returns cost more than the petrol and parking put together. Her car, despite being a pit is still way cleaner than the train, it is reliable and she doesn't have to sit on a grotty seat full of someone else's beer farts.
No, we don't need cars which do 35 mpg, what we need is a sensible all round approach to the problemS - yes, plural, there is more than one problem here.
Get the motorways running again, let's have some proper control on the railways, e.g. more carriages during rush hour and lets actively encourage the shops to stock the more lightly travelled foodstuffs. That might get some wagons off the roads.
Oh and as a final stab at our communist overlords, where the hell are the government laboratories which do all the research into more efficient fuels, engines, public transport, flexible working for those who are able, decentralising the production of food, etc etc??? And I mean scientists doing scientific research, not some idiot with a degree in sociology sitting on some quango.
Nope, until I see some joined up thinking being applied I, for one, am not going to buy a car simply because it fits said idiot's template. And nor will I use that filthy, overpriced, run down system they call public transport either. Latest price for open return from Tamworth to Euston - £131.00 and that's STANDARD CLASS!!! So, £262 for the Mrs and me to go to London for the day. Cheaper to hire a limo ;)

Love to see someone having a rant! :D

well said and i concur wholeheartedly.
 
Just give me 3 minutes and a pickaxe handle, that's all I ask!! :devil:

look what i do for a living then PM me;) . you will spare the 3 minutes and save a harmless piece of wood:devil:
 
The Clio I use only averages around 31mpg. Does that make it a gas-guzzler ?
 
The Clio I use only averages around 31mpg. Does that make it a gas-guzzler ?

No, but the fact you're a driving instructor means the car is never out of second gear ;) Except when being driven by the instructor of course :D
Still, if our communist overlords get their way then the clio will have to go :eek:
Tell me, what on God's earth is more efficient than a modern Clio? I mean, do they do a 50cc version? (with even more pedals, like the old mopeds)
Ahhhh, what it was to be 16 with my trusty Yamaha FS1E.
 
Depends on what version of Clio it is. 31 mpg doesn't sound too hot to me.

Whatever we may think and say (rant) we do indeed need to do something about fuel consumption and pollution so cars being a fairly major contributor are going to be targetted.

Shops are attempting to sell more local produce to reduce mileage and even companies marketing such things as washing liquid are advertising concentrate to reduce road miles.

We probably need to get our thinking caps on..well that's if we can retrieve our heads from somewhere, before it's too late.
 
Tamworth to Euston - £131.00 and that's STANDARD CLASS!!! So, £262 for the Mrs and me to go to London for the day. Cheaper to hire a limo
Cheapest saver return I found in 10 seconds is £36

Perhaps you should try public transport now and again, its normally cheaper, less stressful and quicker than traversing our fine country using our exemplary motorway system. ;)

Ade
 
We probably need to get our thinking caps on..well that's if we can retrieve our heads from somewhere, before it's too late.
I accept that fossil fuel is not a bottomless reservoir which will never run out but are you suggesting there is a cause for concern?


Regards
John
 
I'd suggest the same complacency that is behind the current credit events may be behind many other aspects of our existence.

I fear the issues under discussion will not go away quietly.

Ade
 
We probably need to get our thinking caps on..well that's if we can retrieve our heads from somewhere, before it's too late.

I would agree if it would make the slightest bit of difference. It won't. As long as we accept countries like China building a new coal fired power station every week then my E500 only averaging 25 mpg is irrelevant.
Like I said in a previous post, there are many problems here and this is picking at the outer edges.
If we really want to make a difference, as opposed to finding yet another excuse to tax the car owner, then how about halting all imports from China and other similar countries. If the demand goes away they won't need those power stations.
Likewise let's see some serious investment into our own manufacturing industries so we are not reliant on such imports.
Dieselman, I don't disagree with your sentiment but the efficiency of the internal combustion engine is a mere sprat in a whole ocean of problems.
Dom
 
Likewise let's see some serious investment into our own manufacturing industries so we are not reliant on such imports.

can't agree here, I am dead against nationalisation, it doesn't work.

Dieselman, I don't disagree with your sentiment but the efficiency of the internal combustion engine is a mere sprat in a whole ocean of problems.
Dom

If you can find any other machine that operates at 25% maximum efficiency then please present it.

Cars are a problem because there are so many of them.

We should look to reduce our own emissions irrespective of what others do and although we like to blame other countries that are building fossil fuelled power stations, it needs to be noted that they also have greater use of renewable energy than we do, and use less energy generally.

Per head of capita the worst polluters and energy consumers are the USA then Western Europe. Wouldn't it be prudent to get the worst abusers to reduce their consumption so as to have the greatest impact.?
 

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