Formula One 2018 - General Thread

[Deleted member 126251]

Of course the car makes a huge difference. The clearest example of where driving talent makes the difference is in the wet. Senna at Donnington perhaps the clearest. Button was always pretty awesome in the wet. Of the current crop, when it rains, often as not Lewis quicker than his peers.

Nico (and Alonso) had to resort to some pretty shady stuff to get under Lewis' skin and therefore gain an advantage and a championship. Everyone bangs on about how good Alonso is. Well he wasn't better than Lewis in the same car.

Right now, Ferrari probably have the quickest car, especially in a straight line. It also seems to be a bit easier on its tyres than the Mercedes. Ferrari also have two very quick drivers. So most expected a win from Ferrari this weekend and I think they're favourites for Monza... unless it rains.

Q. F1 is not a popularity contest, so why does Lewis have to be a good loser?

Like I've said above, I don't always like the way Lewis behaves and at times he does let himself down.

I'm pretty sure if it was a German (or any other nation for that matter) driver doing what LH is doing (winning and behaviour) in the MB he would not get the adulation and respect Lewis does from the British. JB was always a gent and one of my all time favourite drivers.

 

[GeeJayW]

I'm pretty sure if it was a German (or any other nation for that matter) driver doing what LH is doing (winning and behaviour) in the MB he would not get the adulation and respect Lewis does from the British. JB was always a gent and one of my all time favourite drivers.

Why would the British pour adulation on a German driver? BTW I was never a Michael Schumacher fan.

JB is a gent and was up there with the best as an F1 driver. I remember watching him tyre testing in his debut season, (in the wet at Silverstone). He was the only driver getting quicker lap by lap. He never quite got the drives he needed and at times on track was perhaps guilty of being a bit too fair. The very best drivers give the other drivers absolutely nothing.

 

[brucemillar]

An interesting read hear from Andrew Benson


'The message is clear to Lewis Hamilton after Belgian GP - Ferrari are fastest' 'The message is clear to Lewis Hamilton after Belgian GP - Ferrari are fastest'


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[Stratman]

If I were at the very top of my game, any game, and had just been comprehensively beaten I'd be in a foul mood too. Having someone stick a microphone in my face asking the incredibly original question "How do you feel?" wouldn't help it either.

This kind of attitude demonstrates to me how important and all consuming winning and being the best is to people like Hamilton. He knew from that race that no matter how good a driver he is, his car won't deliver the performance he needs from here on in. It must hurt to know he is capable of driving faster but his equipment isn't.

I remember criticism of the players on a West Ham forum because after a particularly bad performance and away defeat, the supporters who had made the long and difficult journey witnessed the players on the team coach laughing and joking. "We're fuming, why aren't they?" was the gist of it, just a bit more colourful.

 

[GeeJayW]

.....
This kind of attitude demonstrates to me how important and all consuming winning and being the best is to people like Hamilton. He knew from that race that no matter how good a driver he is, his car won't deliver the performance he needs from here on in. It must hurt to know he is capable of driving faster but his equipment isn't....

Especially when he is confident of beating anyone in the same car (even if he's wrong).

 

[Dryce]

Especially when he is confident of beating anyone in the same car (even if he's wrong).

I don't think there's much that separates LH, SV, MV, and FA.

But I think over any given season in the same equipment my money would be on LH to shave it over a season. MV would lose out on DNFs. Assuming LH actually brings his A game to a circuit then there are only a few occasions where SV's narrower sweet spot would be an advantage - and in the rain while he's no slouch I think LH would get the advantage almost every time.

FA is the hard one to judge. LH had the measure of him in 2007 and since both have got better. But I think the differentiator is perhaps the relationship with the team. Over one or more seasons I think FA doesn't manage synergy. I think SV, LH, and MV would all have better relationshsips with their teams. And that would give them a major advantage over FA.

 

[GeeJayW]

^^ yep, agree!

 

[ShinyF1]

Mmm

Wikipedia (always correct - not!) seems to suggest it "debuted" at the 1982 Belgian GP?

If the C4 programme is correct though, ie it didn’t actually race, the pedant in me would argue that it wasn’t therefore strictly a Grand Prix car, just a design exercise.

I think it held the Goodwood FoS hill record for a few years until Nick Heidfeld let one rip in a contemporary McLaren


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[Deleted member 65149]

Mmm

Wikipedia (always correct - not!) seems to suggest it "debuted" at the 1982 Belgian GP?

If the C4 programme is correct though, ie it didn’t actually race, the pedant in me would argue that it wasn’t therefore strictly a Grand Prix car, just a design exercise.

I got the impression from the Guy Martin programme (that I thoroughly enjoyed - especially the sound of the V8 Cosworth) that it was more than just a design exercise. It sounded more like the FIA pulled the rug from beneath them at the last moment.

 

[baxlin]

I got the impression from the Guy Martin programme (that I thoroughly enjoyed - especially the sound of the V8 Cosworth) that it was more than just a design exercise. It sounded more like the FIA pulled the rug from beneath them at the last moment.

I agree completely, Williams designed it to be a competitive F1 car, which presumably it would have been HAD IT RACED! But as it (according to the programme) didn’t race in F1, it wasn’t an F1 car.

By saying design exercise, I was trying to illustrate the frustration Williams must have felt when the rules were changed, as in "reduced to a design exercise".

Possibly 'design exercise' wasn’t the best use of words, 'white elephant' would be totally unfair, as it obviously worked, but in F1 terms, how else could it be described?

FWIW, I think it should have been allowed to race, 4WD included, however it may well have lost out on tyre-change pitstops.

Coming back to the programme, which I enjoyed very much, they made great play on the fact that the 4 wheeler had to be meticulously rebuilt, but no mention of the 6 wheeler.....

Presumably they didn’t drive this straight off the museum stand!

 

[GeeJayW]

...

FWIW, I think it should have been allowed to race, 4WD included, however it may well have lost out on tyre-change pitstops.

Coming back to the programme, which I enjoyed very much, they made great play on the fact that the 4 wheeler had to be meticulously rebuilt, but no mention of the 6 wheeler.....

Presumably they didn’t drive this straight off the museum stand!

If the six wheeler has been at the FoS, setting records up the hill, it may well have already been in running condition. Whereas the 4-wheeler needed work to make it trackworthy.

As for not allowing it to race, one must bear in mind what FIA stands for...

 

[baxlin]

And now to Monza!

Quick question about grid penalties incurred through using too many engines/gearboxes etc.

Take Alonso's car damage last week, and say he’d already used his allocation for the season, and that in the crash the engine was rendered u/s.

Would he be awarded a grid penalty for having to use a new unit? If so, it hardly seems fair, as it wasn’t a mechanical breakdown, and certainly not his or McLaren's fault. Should arguably come from Hulkenberg's allowance!

Is this covered in the rules, anyone know?

 

[Deleted member 113659]

Yes. Alonso would receive a penalty. Seems unfair given the accident wasn’t his doing but those are the rules for all.

 

[GeeJayW]

Thought this might be of interest...

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[brucemillar]

Yes. Alonso would receive a penalty. Seems unfair given the accident wasn’t his doing but those are the rules for all.

It does seem unfair because it would be unfair. However (not defending it) F1 teams have a glorious history of finding cracks, loopholes, gaps and employing lawyers to exploit these. We have already seen Puquet junior crashing deliberately at the behest of his management. So sadly these rules are enforced as they are written in a (sometimes) vain effort to quell the “cheats”




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[GeeJayW]

It does seem unfair because it would be unfair. However (not defending it) F1 teams have a glorious history of finding cracks, loopholes, gaps and employing lawyers to exploit these. We have already seen Puquet junior crashing deliberately at the behest of his management. So sadly these rules are enforced as they are written in a (sometimes) vain effort to quell the “cheats”

... and the last time I held an FIA rulebook, the rules were written in both French and English. So as there can be minor differences from literal translation and grammar, the teams exploit whichever (langauge) version of each regulation gives them the best advantage.

That said, there may be a carefully worded 'Force Majeur' clause that might offer leeway for Alonso/Mclaren. However without a copy of the current regs in my hand and time to work through the details, I wouldn't know.

 

[Deleted member 113659]

Finally got around to watching the Guy Martin F1 programme last night. A really enjoyable hour indeed featuring two of my favourite guys

 

[whitenemesis]

Doh!

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Vettel suffers embarrassing shunt in Milan F1 demo

 

[GeeJayW]

Oops! Cold tyres, tight diff, powerful engine, ridiculous course.... easy to get that wrong I think.

 

[zipdip]

Well right from the start of this season MB have been very cautious about the length of the season and the number of engines/gearboxes that can be used,at Spa we have both MB and Ferrari having a new engine,,but it seems that MB issued what they call a "phase document " this seems to govern just what power bands can be used at that race it is also binding on Williams and Force India,my guess is Ferrari points behind in F1 allowed their new engine to be in a higher power band only turning it down when the safety car came out and when the lead over LH was great enough,I am not sure the MB view is the correct one sure at the start of the year ok,but even with a penalty and your car at the back of the grid the top 3 teams can be right back into the big points scored by the end of the race,we are very near the first practice at Monza and I predict that MB will allow the new engine to roar,cannot wait to watch this race.