The EV fact thread

[Bobby Dazzler]

All true, Young Roberto. etc etc

Roberto makes me feel much less like I’m in trouble

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Gordon Murray's T50 being the exception to all those 'auto' only Hypercars with its 6 speed Xtrac manual box.

That’s because he’s an old fool, like the rest of us old fools, building the car that the rest of us old fools would like him to build for us, ie a McLaren F1 for those of us old fools who can’t afford a McLaren F1 but can afford to buy a hypercar. It’s admittedly a small group of old fools.

To the rest of the world it’s a last hurrah for the ICE car, an improved version of arguably the best car ever made. To Gordon it’s his opportunity to build the car he really wanted to build without the constraints of doing it for his employer, and applying modern technology. It’s isn’t quite the last hurrah though, there’s another one coming.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

That’s because he’s an old fool, like the rest of us old food, building the car that the rest of us old fools would like him to build for us, ie a McLaren F1 for those of us old fools who can’t afford a McLaren F1 but can afford to buy a hypercar. It’s admittedly a small group of old fools.

To the rest of the world it’s a last hurrah for the ICE car an improved car of arguably the best car ever made. To Gordon it’s his opportunity to build the car he really wanted to build without the constraints of doing it for your employer, and applying modern technology. It’s isn’t quite the last hurrah though, there’s another one coming.

(Cough) And then there's the 911 GT3,

but more importantly the Mx5, the MINI and even the Morgan....

 

[markjay]

Low cost cars are more likely to be manual, less likely to have an automatic option (or be suited to an automatic option).

Automatic transmissions tend to be expensive to manufacture (and buy) and tend to work best with torquey engines.

Superminis and medium sized cars with small engines might still be best with manual gearboxes.

True. The automatic transmission robs disproportionately more power from a small engine than from a more powerful one.

Traditionally, small cars with automatic transmission felt underpowered and struggled with acceleration.

And, I believe that the official 0-60 figures for the C-Class are better for car equipped with manual transmissions than automatic.

 

[Mactech]

By 2040 ICE manuals will be so rare that they actually become desirable and more valuable for a certain few enthusiasts.

One exception may be sports motorcycles. Auto transmissions have been tried several times over many years and with the exception of small commuters never achieved much market success. I'm not aware that there are currently any auto sports bikes only a couple of middle weight Honda tourers. Even Motogp bikes are still foot change manual, albeit with some electronic trickery to facilitate clutch less changes.

I have no desire to ride an auto motorcycle as gear changing is part of the fun and much easier than in a manual car. In fact I would say there is a simple relationship that says manual gear changing becomes less desirable as vehicle weight increases. It's more tiresome to drive a heavy manual car than it is to drive a light weight one.

I think that is a good spot about the weight and autos. Having been the owner of a a wide range of cars and bikes of both manual and auto, I can see some connection with the weight theory.
I also have a theory about the amount of influence that operators of machines (drivers or riders) can have on the performance of the whole package is proportional their weight relative to the package weight. Think 125GP rider (maybe 50%!) vs Nascar stock car (almost 2 tonnes)....
But that has almost nothing to do with EV's !
Unless we look at the relative weight of energy sources ....

 

[Noitz]

Polestar on the brink of bankruptcy? Who's next?

The Swedish major bank SEB writes down Polestar's value to NOK 0. Thus Polestar is under enormous pressure and risks going bankrupt in the worst case, according to an analyst.
The Swedish major bank Skandinaviska Enskilda Banken (SEB) has written down Polestar's value to NOK 0. It happens after the bank, which is among the three largest in Sweden, has reviewed the latest quarterly accounts from Volvo Cars, which owns 49 percent of Polestar.
"Polestar has become a hole in the ground, and we didn't see that a few years ago," says Stefan Cederberg, equity strategist at SEB, according to Dagens Industri.
SEB, together with Goldman Sachs, were the most important advisers when Volvo Cars was listed back in 2021. Now the bank believes that the stake in Polestar is worth nothing to Volvo Cars. The value has been written down from SEK 18 billion to SEK O.
"It had to come to light that the electric car manufacturers are struggling with earnings in a buyer's market with many new players who find it difficult to sell enough electric cars," says Nicolas Fredriksen, an analyst for Mobilsiden.dk,

 

[Dryce]

True. The automatic transmission robs disproportionately more power from a small engine than from a more powerful one.

Traditionally, small cars with automatic transmission felt underpowered and struggled with acceleration.

And, I believe that the official 0-60 figures for the C-Class are better for car equipped with manual transmissions than automatic.

In SE Asia it's perfectly normal for a small car to have an automatic transmission. The UK has a hangup about them,

Since the early 2000's it has been normal for automatic transmissions to have lockup. Since mid 2000's then robotised automatics have been available - DSG or single clutch setups.

There is a myth that automatics are slower. It was understood even back in the 80s when old fashioned 3 speed autos were available that mid range acceleration was typically better in an auto than an equivalent manual. In the 2000s MG had an automatic MGF and published a 0-60 time (slower) for the auto but did not publish a mid range 30-50 or 30-70 time for the auto. Traditional autos were slower 0-60 but modern setups with launch control are faster in the real world than a manual - not that a 0-60 time is "real world" but rather a spurious top trumps invention.

EVs take this to a different level - but the reality for that last 20 years has been that the real-world advantages of a manual over an auto have been accepted as fact base on pre-2000 autos vs manuals not post 2000 autos vs manuals - with the perpetual utterly stupid focus on 0-60 time as a measure of usable performance masking the reality.

 

[markjay]

We'll, here one benefit of owning an EV:

From:

Most stolen cars of 2023: A vehicle was pinched every 8 mins last year

A total of 64,087 cars were reported stolen to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency, up from 61,106 in 2022, exclusive data shared with MailOnline and This is Money shows.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Dryce]

"It had to come to light that the electric car manufacturers are struggling with earnings in a buyer's market with many new players who find it difficult to sell enough electric cars," says Nicolas Fredriksen, an analyst for Mobilsiden.dk,

And in the UK the cost of a pre-reg delivery mileage 73 plate Mercedes EQC seems to have dropped yet further - £49998 a month before Christmas, £47998 after Christmas, and now £45998 as we head through January.

 

[SmartAmg]

We'll, here one benefit of owning an EV:

From:

Most stolen cars of 2023: A vehicle was pinched every 8 mins last year

A total of 64,087 cars were reported stolen to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency, up from 61,106 in 2022, exclusive data shared with MailOnline and This is Money shows.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Yep, they're not as easy to steal as ICE cars.

 

[MeQ]

And in the UK the cost of a pre-reg delivery mileage 73 plate Mercedes EQC seems to have dropped yet further - £49998 a month before Christmas, £47998 after Christmas, and now £45998 as we head through January.

Dumping stock in readiness to discontinue old tech/platform models.

 

[markjay]

Yep, they're not as easy to steal as ICE cars.

Or maybe no one wants them, not even the thieves?

 

[SmartAmg]

Or maybe no one wants them, not even the thieves?

That's one theory, I prefer mine.

 

[grober]

to lighten the mood!

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[Steveml63]

Hi,
Apart from rare & special sports cars - 99% of all cars sold in the Middle East are both petrol & have automatic transmissions.
There are virtually no diesel cars sold in this region and also virtually no manual cars are sold here.
Cheers
Steve

 

[grober]

Then there is the way manfacturers should be going- cheap and cheerful.

Citroen Progressive Hydraulic Cushions Replace Hydropneumatic Suspension

At the end of 2017, Citroen will replace the acclaimed hydropneumatic suspension system with progressive hydraulic cushions

www.autoevolution.com

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[MikeInWimbledon]

Hi,
Apart from rare & special sports cars - 99% of all cars sold in the Middle East are both petrol & have automatic transmissions.
There are virtually no diesel cars sold in this region and also virtually no manual cars are sold here.
Cheers
Steve

And on that theme I recently came across the stat for manual transmission sales in the USA.

One percent of new car sales.

One percent.

.

 

[SmartAmg]

And on that theme I recently came across the stat for manual transmission sales in the USA.

One percent of new car sales.

One percent.

.

As much as that!

 

[Noitz]

And on that theme I recently came across the stat for manual transmission sales in the USA.

One percent of new car sales.

One percent.

.

No accounting for taste, or rather lack of.

 

[Mactech]

Then there is the way manfacturers should be going- cheap and cheerful.

Citroen Progressive Hydraulic Cushions Replace Hydropneumatic Suspension

At the end of 2017, Citroen will replace the acclaimed hydropneumatic suspension system with progressive hydraulic cushions

www.autoevolution.com

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

Ah! But if you can wait just a couple of years after the initial sale date of a 'vintage' BMW i3, you can enjoy a similar range, much better performance and a real composite car for even less money than the little E Citroen. I managed to find one that had been ready run in with 5k miles on it.....and it has the feel of a premium and cheerful car