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The EV fact thread

I really like this new 'in wheel motor' technology for up coming EV's.
I just wonder when they will realise the significance of an additional 40kgs of unsprung weight per wheel?
Tyre construction and damping is going to have to take major leap forward if we are on enjoy the ride quality we can at the moment.


Agreed, that's an additional 25Kg of unsprung weight, that aren't there now (once you remove 15Kg or so for the integrated brake discs and calipers). One can only hope that this is an early model, and later variants will be lighter.

Which reminds me, that my 1978 Alfasud had inboard brake discs at the front, and my 1979 Alfetta had these at the rear - reduction of unsprung weight was a big thing for Alfa at the time. Bizarrely, no one else seem to care about it? Inboard brake discs all but disappeared...
 
Been through this 1000 times. The clue is in the word NEUTRAL.

When the CO2 reduction emphasis is reduced the pollutants that ULEZs care about (NOx and PMs) can more easily be reduced if not entirely eliminated.
It can only be neutral when we have more surplus green electricity than we know what to do with... in the UK that could be decades away.. I like the idea of it....but its just not a feasible reality....even just based on the volumes required. You can tell that by how few makers are even taking it seriously. EVs are just a much better option, especially as the tech moves on... and that from someone who will never buy an EV.....but I'm just realistic about the alternatives.
As for reducing the polution from synthetic fuel cars....well it's a lot more work than using the EV tech that already exists that emits nothing.....especially as EVs are perfectly usable as is for the vast majority of drivers....and new battery tech with faster charging and bigger ranges will reduce the number that can't use them more each year.
 
Had a quick top up at the new Gridserve Electric Forecourt on the A1 by Stevenage, astonishingly good facility, this is the future. 👍

image0.jpg
Why? Because "electricity stations" will sell electricity cheaper and more conveniently than electricity bought at home, from a lamp-post or Sainsbury's? How would they do that ?

Have you ever been to a "Hut Hotel," or a "Railway Hotel?" They were said to be "the future" once, but things moved on.
 
When we have resolved the Co2 issue then the next big thing very much already waiting in the wings is a serious concern about particle emissions from tyres and EV's won't resolve that problem. In fact depending who you believe EV tyre wear is 20% - 67% higher than ICE cars but that depends very much on how they are driven. Tyre particles contain some nasty chemicals which are have been show to kill fish when they are eventually washed down to the sea. The same chemical can be detected in blood tests of people so something will have to be done. Short of getting everyone to drive less aggressively I don't see any way of preventing tyres from shedding particles. The tyre companies have already been challenged to find less toxic chemicals to use in tyre manufacture.

Car tyres produce vastly more particle pollution than exhausts, tests show
 
When we have resolved the Co2 issue then the next big thing very much already waiting in the wings is a serious concern about particle emissions from tyres and EV's won't resolve that problem. In fact depending who you believe EV tyre wear is 20% - 67% higher than ICE cars but that depends very much on how they are driven. Tyre particles contain some nasty chemicals which are have been show to kill fish when they are eventually washed down to the sea. The same chemical can be detected in blood tests of people so something will have to be done. Short of getting everyone to drive less aggressively I don't see any way of preventing tyres from shedding particles. The tyre companies have already been challenged to find less toxic chemicals to use in tyre manufacture.

Car tyres produce vastly more particle pollution than exhausts, tests show

This is correct, and even if offsetting the reduction of particle emissions from brake pads and discs thanks to EV regenerative braking, pollution is still pollution.

To my mind, again, the only real 'green' solution is to close down city centres to all private vehicles.
 
I don't think even the most hard-core city dwelling tree huggers would effectively want to kill their city centre by doing that if they really thought about it. Besides it would just move the polution elsewhere. People want to use their cars.... and apart from the centres of big cities there is no realistic alternative. Something lots of townies completely fail to grasp.
 
Why? Because "electricity stations" will sell electricity cheaper and more conveniently than electricity bought at home, from a lamp-post or Sainsbury's? How would they do that ?

Have you ever been to a "Hut Hotel," or a "Railway Hotel?" They were said to be "the future" once, but things moved on.
I never said it’s cheaper, but when doing lost distances in a day you cannot viably charge from a lamp-post or Sainsburys. These facilities are great for those trips.
 
I don't think even the most hard-core city dwelling tree huggers would effectively want to kill their city centre by doing that if they really thought about it. Besides it would just move the polution elsewhere. People want to use their cars.... and apart from the centres of big cities there is no realistic alternative. Something lots of townies completely fail to grasp.

It's been done in quite a few places, including Edinburgh and Oxford among others. Seems to be working fine? I used to visit Oxford regularly, there is very good public transport to the city centre via rail and coach, in addition to 'Park and Ride' car parks outside the city. And, you can move around the city using local taxis. What's the problem?

Oxford-Tube-Panorama-London-051220-1024x683.jpg
 
I never said it’s cheaper, but when doing lost distances in a day you cannot viably charge from a lamp-post or Sainsburys. These facilities are great for those trips.

It can take a while to get your head around the fact that 'how much is the cost per mile in an EV?' is a nonsensical question that belongs to ICE era of old. It's like asking a Diesel or petrol car driver how many bales of hay does their car consume per day... :D
 
It's been done in quite a few places, including Edinburgh and Oxford among others. Seems to be working fine? I used to visit Oxford regularly, there is very good public transport to the city centre via rail and coach, in addition to 'Park and Ride' car parks outside the city. And, you can move around the city using local taxis. What's the problem?

Oxford-Tube-Panorama-London-051220-1024x683.jpg
Cost, convenience, reliability, cleanliness, flexibility, privacy etc etc etc.....plus the almost complete lack of a usable service outside the biggest conerbations. And I want to use my car, listen to my music at my volume, be at my temperature and go door to door. All those reasons I have, and pay for, a car in the first place.if public transport could even offer most of that id have been using it before ULEZ!
 
Today's exciting you couldn't make it up comedy gold snippet from the twilight zone that is the Nissan Leaf Facebook page........

"I'm staying in a hotel soon that doesn't have EV charging facilities, I want to run a extension lead from my hotel window to the car park, what one shall I buy"

Words really do fail me :doh:

(Fortunately the poster was universally slated much to my surprise)
 
[QUOTE="poormansporsche

"I'm staying in a hotel soon that doesn't have EV charging facilities, I want to run a extension lead from my hotel window to the car park, what one shall I buy"

Words really do fail me :doh:
[/QUOTE]

Yep, you get, them on every forum. 😉🙂
 
I never said it’s cheaper, but when doing lost distances in a day you cannot viably charge from a lamp-post or Sainsburys. These facilities are great for those trips.
But how many people actually do long distances in a day?

And how often will people want to pay 25p / mile rather than Supermarket or home charging rates like 3 or 4p / mile ?

Agreed, no-one minds paying £1.90 a litre for petrol at Motorway services, but Motorway Services never were the future of petrol stations either.

And most vehicles are parked up more than 90% of the time, after all.
 
Lots of people on this forum apparently 🤣😉
How many of those are EV drivers? Most that that talk about doing 400 miles in a day seem to roll about it elderly ICE, and seem to be the type that don’t choose to buy motorway service diesel at £1.80 a litre.

Don’t get me wrong. I do 800 miles in a 36 hour trip four or six times a year, so I can see the benefit of a convenient expensive fast charge two or three times a year, But the other 95% of charges are going to be at home, work, or while parked for shopping or leisure, which is why I’m challenging the idea that supersized charging stations on motorways are “the future of charging.”
 
Given the inefficiency inherent in charging with a 'granny cable' (which has a CO2 cost and will continue to until all electricity is from renewables) runs counter to decarbonisation, how long before it's outlawed? Legislation banning the provision on new EVs would end it pretty smartly. At which point all electricity for EVs could have VAT at a rate higher than domestic 5%. How many will lose their appetite for an EV when this occurs?
 
But how many people actually do long distances in a day?
I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again - I do love posts (often EV related) which start with this gem. As a very wise, warm hearted, incredibly generous, and charismatically handsome man once said:

Until EVs became mainstream I hadn’t realised how many people have to tow their twin axle caravan from Glasgow to Morocco three times every week, with 6 passengers, 4 bikes and 2 dobermans, and they must only stop for a maximum of 5 minutes once to refuel.

I’d like to see an EV do that. And until they can - and do so for a purchase price of £5k and the energy cost no more than 10% of the cost of petrol and diesel then EVs are doomed to fail. I almost forgot that must be 10% based upon the energy prices in 1993.

And don’t get me even started on charging infrastructure (there are only three working chargers in the whole of the UK and they’re all in Daventry, and the need to replace the battery packs every 6 weeks at a cost three times greater than the cost of the car is past a joke.

The batteries are made by children and raw materials are mined by corrupt governments. During manufacture those materials must circumnavigate the world six times. A diesel must travel 544k miles before it even equals the CO2 output of manufacturing one battery.

Then there’s using it. Wind turbines don’t work without storm force winds and solar panels only work in June, so the the so called green EV is using electricity produced from fossil fuels. Hello sheeple, when will you wake up and smell the diesel fumes, I mean coffee?

And let‘s not kid ourselves, when “they” eventually install enough public chargers, the national grid can’t cope with simultaneously charging 37 million EVs from stone dead to the 150% we must all insist upon in case we have to go to the airport early one morning.

Need i mention the fact that 99.2% of the population don’t have a driveway to charge their car on, and so pavements will be littered with charging cables? And 98.7% of people rent their home and there’s no way landlords will pay to install chargers.

I could go on, but I’ll leave you with these final thoughts.

I read on an anti EV forum that a member spoke to someone in the queue at the barbers, who had read in the letters page of Auto Express that a disappointed EV driver who was forced to have an EV as a company car by their employer found that:

1. The 200 mile range claimed by the manufacturer can fall to as low as 169 miles if you drive at 112 mph in the midday heat of the Sahara desert, or in temperatures below -42 degrees C. We get both extremes every day here in Luton.

2. They had to take their car back for a recall, and the dealer told them that there had been another one in for the same recall the week before, and that the senior master technician said that they had once done a warranty claim on an EV too. The headlamps misted up.

3. In 2022, at the main dealer it takes nine senior master technicians three days to make an EV safe enough to change the window wiper blades. In 1977 I changed the engine in my Ford Granada on the footpath, on my own, at night, in 20 minutes. And that’s progress?

4. The UK is accountable for 0.7% of global CO2 emissions, and privately own cars make up 0.1% of that, so unless China stop building 92 coal powered power stations every week then there’s absolutely no point doing anything about it.

EVs aren’t the solution, but that won’t stop the Government forcing everyone to buy an EV just like they forced everyone to buy a diesel. We should definitely invest in hydrogen, hydrogen is definitely the future and the infrastructure could definitely be ready by next week.
 
Given the inefficiency inherent in charging with a 'granny cable' (which has a CO2 cost and will continue to until all electricity is from renewables) runs counter to decarbonisation, how long before it's outlawed? Legislation banning the provision on new EVs would end it pretty smartly. At which point all electricity for EVs could have VAT at a rate higher than domestic 5%. How many will lose their appetite for an EV when this occurs?

I agree that granny cable charging presents all sorts of problems, including the inability to fully tax the electricity used. The way forward for those who have a driveway is a dedicated smart charger (7/11/22kW) that can let the utility company know how much to charge for the electricity used (including added duty/taxation). The chargers can be fitted using a government grant, as is already the case in many European countries. This subsidy will be recouped over time via the taxation revenue. BTW, electricity from public chargers already incurs the full 20% VAT, while people using home chargers currently only pay the lower domestic rate.
 

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