Early W212 E Class vs BMW F10 5 Series opinions

[derektrotter]

Hi All

Was hoping for some opinions from people who have driven both the W212 and BMW F10 5 Series, if you had a £14k budget which one would you go for? due to budget it'll be the early models of each so I'm a bit concerned about reliability of both models, looks like I can just about get a approved used for either car.

I did own a one of the very late W211 which was very reliable as all the bugs had been ironed out, hoping for something with similar reliability as really do not want to take out a warranty every year so running costs is a big consideration.

Advice (unbiased as much as possible) appreciated

 

[james.raban]

Hi Derek, I had an F10 520d M Sport for a few days whilst I was on the hunt for a new car. Looked great, felt very solid, handled well and the interior quality was excellent, if a little functional. The 2.0d is good but underpowered in the F10. I think a 530d would be an excellent buy. I found the spec could be messily too.

Drove the E too, but didn't have it as long. If felt more luxurious than the F10, classically styled interior that really makes you feel special. Not as modern in style maybe, but that's down to personal taste. Not as sporty, but more comfortable and relaxing. 220d is powerful enough, twin turbo really helps but it can be unrefined sometimes...just sometimes, not all the time...so again, the 6 block would be better.

For me it's down to this...do you want a sporty car or a luxury car? Buy the F10 if you want something sporty and the Merc if you prefer a relaxed drive.

 

[derektrotter]

Thanks for the reply, I do want the most luxury and (in pictures anyway) prefer the look of the interior of the W212, however a work colleague with the 5 series found the gearbox slow of the W212 hence he went for the 5, he said the BMW flies thru the gears whereas the E was slow in comparison.

I've only got the W211 to compare with but must admit compared to some other cars I've driven the gearbox of the W211 did seem a bit old school, if the W212 is similar to that it would put me off a bit, I noticed the early one is 5 speed which is what I had too.

 

[Deleted member 37751]

The 7G plus gearbox which was fitted from around 2011 iirc was a big jump up in refinement and quicker gear changes.

 

[james.raban]

I have the 7g in my C220 and it's very good...better to seek out the 7g!

 

[derektrotter]

Thanks I'll have a look at that, I would want a E250, may try and drive both BMW and MB, trouble is its so hard to decide based on short drives, also I'm very familiar with MB, BMW the range of options I find confusing, also worried about the reliability as I've only owned Merc.

My E220 W211 (2008) did feel quite sluggish hence me looking at things like the gearbox, I imagine the E250 would be a much better improvement.

 

[james.raban]

Any reason you wouldn't seek out a 6 cylinder Derek?

 

[derektrotter]

Mainly fuel economy but also with the currently developing stance on diesel not sure what the future holds, besides I test drove a C250 a couple of years ago and it seemed quick enough, E250 I'm hoping will feel similar, on the BMW front not yet sure what the equivalent is to the 250, I estimate the twin turbo engines will be quick enough for me without looking at the 3L ones.

 

[PXW]

Just sold a BMW F11 having previously had an S211 and now driving an S212. My two penn'orth:

Gearboxes: better as you get newer. MB 7 speed was absolutely fine, occasionally a little slow responding. BM 8 speed is brilliant. But so far I also find the S212 9 speed to be at least as good, possibly a little better.

Handling. 211 to F11 was exactly what you would expect - sharper handling on the BM, better feeling of connection with the car/road/what the wheels are doing etc. The big surprise for me is that I find the S212 handles markedly better than the F11 - more agile, better turn in, better body control in the bends etc.

Engines. Both MBs were/are 3.0v6. The BM was the four cylinder two litre single turbo. Overall performance was similar between the 211 and the F11, but the latter always felt it was working harder. Ultimately I found I really missed the torque of the big diesels, hence now with the E350.

Economy. No surprise that the BM was best here - but not by as much as you might think. For my driving style I found I was pressing harder in the F11, possibly because the lower torque made it a more edgy driving experience. Overall I saw 42mpg out of the F11 versus about 37 out of the 211. Too early to tell yet on the 212, but early indications are that it will fall between the two.

 

[james.raban]

My C220 is quick enough, E250 would be fine no doubt. You can remap the ECU for about £300 to get a further 30 or so HP too. Was thinking of the greater refinement in a 6 cylinder car is all. Equivalent BMW would be the 520d for the E220 and the 525d for the E250.

 

[derektrotter]

Thank you both for the info, so it looks like the 520D is a single turbo as is i'm guessing the E220, so I need to focus on the E250 and 525D.

Reason i'm keen on the twin turbo is the C250 I drove with twin turbo was a totally different car to the W211 E220 I ended up buying of the same year, I'm guessing the twin turbo had a lot to do with this, E220 felt very slow in comparison.

The above may things easier as a quick search on autotrader, the 525D's are £14/15k+ whereas my max budget is £14k, the E250 theres quite a few options below the 14k mark which should give me more choice, none of them seem to mention the 7G however, am I correct in thinking all BlueEfficiency models have the 7G? Also I've seen references to 7G plus in the forum, any idea how to differentiate which cars have this and if its worth trying to pay extra for the 7G plus?

 

[derektrotter]

Edit, they don't mention the 7G as they do not have it, filtered by 50mpg+ Cars (which are 7G) and prices are not too far off the BMW

 

[Brooks22]

The W212 E250cdi is indeed a twin turbo 2.1 litre 4 cylinder. But the 525d is actually a 3.0 single turbo 6 cylinder ( it's the same block as the 530d engine but with a smaller turbo).

If i were you, i wouldn't go for the 250 cdi as I've heard it isn't the nicest engine. Quite agricultural, especially at town speeds. The diesel straight 6 in the bmw is much smoother and quieter, also the economy won't be dramatically worse.

If i were you though, i would try and stretch to a 350cdi with the 3.0 V6. You can sometimes find nice examples on Mercland around about your budget.

I don't know if this would be of interest to you, but you can also get really stunning last of the line, low mileage W211 E320 cdis for £10k.

 

[james.raban]

Newer BMW 525d's are 4 blocks...so it would depend on age, and budget. I would always buy a 6 block if I could afford it though. My C220 is great, but I'd like it more it was a 6 cylinder.

 

[james.raban]

The Merc E220d is a twin turbo by the way...at least my C220 is.

 

[derektrotter]

Thank you all for the replies, after some research not sure I'll even test drive the F10 due to reliability concerns, e.g. 520d down. - F07/F10/F11 2010- - BMW 5 Series Owners Board Bit of a long thread but shocking treatment for a car under the 3 year warranty, especially since fault was actually caused by the dealer while rectifying another!

Think I'll just try find prices of 7g+ cars and go from there, problem is lot of adverts don't mention the gearbox type so not sure if they are the 7g plus.

 

[paul_f]

Isn't the change when they went to column shift? IE if it has a traditional auto shift lever on the tunnel then it is a 5 speed

 

[Deleted member 37751]

Not 100% but I'm pretty certain that 61 plate onwards have the 7G plus.

 

[james.raban]

E250 7G then Derek? Good choice

 

[james.raban]

Saw this car on Auto Trader’s Android App. Thought you might be interested. Mercedes-Benz E Class E220 CDI SE 4dr Auto [7] FULL LEATHER & CRUISE 2.2

Saw this car on Auto Trader’s Android App. Thought you might be interested. Mercedes-Benz E Class 2.1 E200 CDI BlueEFFICIENCY SE 7G-Tronic Plus 4dr (start/stop)

Only E200 and E220 but both 7G's