The EV fact thread

[poormansporsche]

So with a quick calculation, the leaf will cost me a grand more up front but the monthly will be similar. The Swift will likely get 50 mpg so the Leaf will probably only save me a tenner a week on fuel costs with the mileage I do so probably more or less similar costs over 2 years. The extra space would be handy but the Swift is in the top 3 most reliable cars available whilst the Leaf is not ......... So any real world experience would be handy

 

[Skd884]

No brainer - the ev.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

So with a quick calculation, the leaf will cost me a grand more up front but the monthly will be similar. The Swift will likely get 50 mpg so the Leaf will probably only save me a tenner a week on fuel costs with the mileage I do so probably more or less similar costs over 2 years. The extra space would be handy but the Swift is in the top 3 most reliable cars available whilst the Leaf is not ......... So any real world experience would be handy

I have no real world experience of either specific model however based upon my experience of other small EV and small ICE, then I’d say that the Leaf is the better car for what you intend to use it for.

The only thing it won’t do so well is give you that feeling of satisfaction that only a small manual ICE can give, the feeling that you have managed to extract all 10/10ths when ringing it’s neck on a quiet lane.

 

[poormansporsche]

I have no real world experience of either specific model however based upon my experience of other small EV and small ICE, then I’d say that the Leaf is the better car for what you intend to use it for.

The only thing it won’t do so well is give you that feeling of satisfaction that only a small manual ICE can give, the feeling that you have managed to extract all 10/10ths when ringing it’s neck on a quiet lane

I had the SC Mini for my ragging fun travelling to work at 4am everyday but after a few weeks it just became wearisome and went back to the Clio !

Anyway man bag and man bun at the ready, I've cancelled the Swift and ordered the Leaf

It was just too much car for such little money not too !

I missed out on the new one for 14 grand but could have bought a pre registered one with zero miles for 15 grand but decided to lease one as cheap as chips and no worries about resale if not my bag.

In the mad world of leasing, it was going to cost me 20 quid extra month to get the colour I want but 6 quid a month to get the higher spec car with leather, Bose and the right colour included !!!

Madness

 

[Petrol Pete]

In 4 years time the Swift might have some value left in it , the Leaf ?

 

[ToeKnee]

In 4 years time the Swift might have some value left in it , the Leaf ?

Don't they plummet in the autumn?

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Last night I stopped off at the motorway services on the M42 south of Birmingham (I think it’s Hopwiod). It was around 20:00 on Sunday evening, in peak holiday season. The car park was heaving, easily 80-90% of spaces were occupied.

I counted (very quickly) 55 charging bays in one area from where I was parked but there may have been a few more out of my eye line. Five bays were occupied but one was a cheeky ICE wishing to park closer to the doors.

I can’t imagine there being too many busier times during the course of of the year, however there seems to be plenty of capacity for charging.

 

[poormansporsche]

In 4 years time the Swift might have some value left in it , the Leaf ?

Hence why I decided to lease it, not buy it, in 2 years time it will be someone elses problem

I do love the Swift, it's a funky little thing but the Leaf (bar the reliability) is better in every conceivable way, running costs, speed, room, spec so for more or less the same cost it just makes sense.

(We have chargers at work and I haven't even enquired if they are free / subsidised, I didn't want that to effect my decision, but if it turns out they are free to use and I end up saving the 200 quid a month I currently spend on fuel then I'm actually getting the Leaf for free !!!!!! )

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Hence why I decided to lease it, not buy it, in 2 years time it will be someone elses problem

I do love the Swift, it's a funky little thing but the Leaf (bar the reliability) is better in every conceivable way, running costs, speed, room, spec so for more or less the same cost it just makes sense.

(We have chargers at work and I haven't even enquired if they are free / subsidised, I didn't want that to effect my decision, but if it turns out they are free to use and I end up saving the 200 quid a month I currently spend on fuel then I'm actually getting the Leaf for free !!!!!! )

I agree with your way of thinking.

In four years some of the concerns about battery longevity, residual values, charging infrastructure will have faded for many. We’ll have hit used to cars - especially fleet cars depreciating again too.

Unless there’s another U-turn, in four years 52% of car sales must be zero emission vehicles, which in practice will mean EVs so many will be seeing EVs as normal rather than novelty.

Leasing an EV on a competitive deal de-risks any uncertainty though, and so in my humble opinion it’s the sensible thing to do, said the person who bought an EV for personal use

 

[Skd884]

Electric car sales falling short in first year of government mandate

Sales of electric vehicles are lagging behind the government’s zero-emission vehicle (ZEV) mandate for the year, prompting calls for more incentives to...

www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk

 

[Ted]

Last night I stopped off at the motorway services on the M42 south of Birmingham (I think it’s Hopwiod). It was around 20:00 on Sunday evening, in peak holiday season. The car park was heaving, easily 80-90% of spaces were occupied.

I counted (very quickly) 55 charging bays in one area from where I was parked but there may have been a few more out of my eye line. Five bays were occupied but one was a cheeky ICE wishing to park closer to the doors.

I can’t imagine there being too many busier times during the course of of the year, however there seems to be plenty of capacity for charging.

Agreed.
My bladder and fuel tank meant that I had to pull into Cobham on the M25 at around 19:00 last night.
Absolutely rammed, but I noticed that there were plenty of spaces at the charging stations with easy access.
Easy to fill up too, to be fair, but at £85, I’ll bet it was a bit more expensive than adding 450 miles of electricity.

 

[ALFAitalia]

I could not even fill my car up last time...I reached the £99 pre authorised limit before it was full.. lol. You could buy a lot of miles of electricity for £99. My neighbours 7p per kwh home charge rate and 3.5 miles kwh would mean about 4950 miles....whereas I will get about 675 miles on average....massive difference. Obviously you could pay ten times that amount at a public charger....I've heard of people paying an insane 74 p..... that makes it rather LESS economical than my derv.....which is I guess why over 80% of all UK EV charging is done at home.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Junior D may have been taking eco driving lesson from our Champion of Champions @Mactech

Today was her first day of driving alone - in the FIAT 500e - since passing her test, and she’s done more than 70 miles. In the final leg home she managed a very impressive 6.8 miles per kWh.

She left home with the battery partially charged, as she only expected to drive 20 miles, so once she knew she’d be travelling much further she antivpated that she had to charge at some point.

As a new driver she doesn’t carry baggage of past experience, and charged when she could - at a supermarket - by the time she had been in and then called me it had topped up more than enough.

That wasn’t even a fast charge, it was a public 7.2 kW charger. She could have stopped at several supermarket along the route but chose the one she knew she could charge at.

It’s a good job that she managed 6.8 mi/kWh on that final leg - to offset the rest of the convoy, with Mrs D driving a 5.5 biturbo SUV in front of her and with me driving a 6.2 litre SUV behind her!

Someone spotted us and posted this photo on the soshulls:

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

“Short arms and long pockets” here again…. Two points about motorway chargers.

Why would anyone use them but to occasionally top up, just a little? Not only because they’re FAR more expensive than home charging but also far more expensive than Supermarkets or town centre charging. Yes, they have their place, but that place is the commercial traveller / “expensed crowd.”

Secondly, we don’t know what Starmer KC will do about taxing EV’s going forward. “Anything could happen in the next 12 months.”

Will he increase taxes or petrol, diesel, or commercial EV charging? Nobody knows…. Folks “want” change but equally the Treasury needs a few greenwashed billions to pay for salary increases

 

[BTB 500]

First mention I've seen of ZEV mandate penalties potentially being relaxed:

Carmakers who fail to meet the zero-emission vehicle (ZEV) mandate face a penalty of £15,000 a car but are expected to escape punishment by vowing to meet future targets between now and 2035, when the petrol and diesel car ban comes into effect.

Electric car sales set to miss a key Government target as demand slows

The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders expect electric cars to make up 18.5% of all new registrations by the end of 2024.

www.thisismoney.co.uk

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

First mention I've seen of ZEV mandate penalties potentially being relaxed:

Electric car sales set to miss a key Government target as demand slows

The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders expect electric cars to make up 18.5% of all new registrations by the end of 2024.

www.thisismoney.co.uk

Apart from my repeated comments over the last six years that “we love EU deadlines.”

“It’s that whooshing noise that they make as they go by.”

No-one believed that the 2024 deadline wouldn’t slide, be softened, or “tempered” by accounting workaround fiddles.

As they always are.

 

[BTB 500]

Apart from my repeated comments over the last six years that “we love EU deadlines.”

“It’s that whooshing noise that they make as they go by.”

No-one believed that the 2024 deadline wouldn’t slide, be softened, or “tempered” by accounting workaround fiddles.

As they always are.

For sure, but this is the first mention of it actually happening that I've seen in the news. The other thing I read this week (forget where) is that companies would be allowed to 'trade' quotas between themselves.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

For sure, but this is the first mention of it actually happening that I've seen in the news. The other thing I read this week (forget where) is that companies would be allowed to 'trade' quotas between themselves.

I believe car companies are already trading quotas and EV only brands like Tesla will do quite well out of it.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I believe car companies are already trading quotas and EV only brands like Tesla will do quite well out of it.

$1,800,000,000 in revenue for Tesla from selling quotas in 2023 alone ? Yes you could describe that as “doing quite well out of it.”

Pure additional profit for the last seven years, as car makers circumvent the regulatory restrictions on selling in California, the EU and China.

 

[markjay]

I am currently in Norway, initially I was surprised at the number of Tesla cars on the road, seems that subsidies and cheap electricity do the trick for EVs in general, but the locals are very keen on Tesla in particular for some reason:

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/03/16/how-tesla-became-the-top-selling-car-company-in-norway.html

"Norway has had massive success with EV adoption — 82% of new cars sold in the country in 2023 were electric, according to the Norwegian Road Federation. This high adoption rate can be attributed to the generous subsidies the Scandinavian country has offered to electric vehicle owners as well as its investment in charging infrastructure.

Tesla’s sales in the country may represent only a sliver of the 1.8 million vehicles the company delivered globally last year, but its importance to the EV maker goes beyond revenue. Tesla’s early foothold there has made Norway a pivotal proving ground for the company and a national model for electric vehicle transition. As a result, Tesla CEO Elon Musk has taken a number of trips to the small Nordic country and has often praised its support for the technology change."