The EV fact thread

[markjay]

I live on a narrow country lane where the NSL applies ... 30 is pretty fast along there, and 60 would be suicidal. As mentioned above it's inappropriate speed that's the issue, not whether you're breaking the speed limit or not.

The benefits of driving slower in general:

- The driver has more time to react to developing situations on the road.
- Other drivers have more time to react to and try and avoid colliding with the driver's car.
- In the event of a collision, the damage to both metal and flesh will be less severe.
- By not exceeding the legal speed limit for the road, in the event of a collision, the driver avoids putting themselves in a potentially more difficult legal position.

The downsides of driving slower:

- Driving at a slower speed than other cars on the road may actually increase the likelihood of a collision in some circumstances.
- Drivers will get to their destinations at a later time than if they were driving faster.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This is how I see it...

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Speed itself cannot kill...Apollo 10 reached 24,791mph.....with no harm to the occupants! Something else needs to happen at the the same time before it becomes an issue!

Aye, but a child didn’t step out in front of it, that time

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I live on a narrow country lane where the NSL applies ... 30 is pretty fast along there, and 60 would be suicidal. As mentioned above it's inappropriate speed that's the issue, not whether you're breaking the speed limit or not.

The speed limit being the nation’s view of the maximum appropriate speed for that road, not the recommended speed.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Sure, but from a road safety POV a legal 50 mph down a tiny country lane is far more dangerous than an illegal 75 on a quiet motorway.

Exactly which is why it’s the maximum speed allowed, not the recommended speed.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

The 2.4 million plus drivers a year who receive FPNs would probably disagree

Pardon? What makes you think it’s 2.4 million drivers? ( It’s 2.4 million FPN’s)

BTW it’s 15 years or more since I’ve received one.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

'Inappropriate' use of speed can kill.

Exactly, which is why Sad IQ has put 20mph limits across London.

To protect children and to improve air quality for Markjay

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Let us try (again) to drag this thread on track . Here is everyone's favourite mild mannered Geography teacher turned rabid anti EV guy.

Not all fact , but the bit about Rolls Royce certainly seems like a fact.

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Charismatic and compelling. That could be our future leader of the resistance right there. “They” don’t stand a chance.

 

[Mactech]

Charismatic and compelling. That could be our future leader of the resistance right there. “They” don’t stand a chance.

I'm certainly not convinced that EV's are the saviours of transport as we know it. It didn't take a genius to work out that air travel was never going to go electric, anybody with O level physics can do that!
I have not been railroaded into EV's, but my circumstances have aligned with the effort of manufactures to pay attention to the EV concept. The reasons I have an EV are:

• My wife thought the BMW was a fun and acceptable car to have.
• I have liked carbon construction cars since I first started to see their benefits in motorsport 40 years ago.
• I have surplus electrical solar energy from the Eco home I moved to 3 years ago.
• I have a nationalistic frugality streak (....ducks and takes cover from national generalisations....)
• August 2022 seemed to be the time that the prices of i3's stopped the free fall of the previous 10 months.
• I own a very nice 'long range' car in the Macan.
• The low centre of gravity and instant access to huge torque makes the car genuinely fun to drive.

I understand that these facts will not align with everyone.

 

[BTB 500]

Let us try (again) to drag this thread on track . Here is everyone's favourite mild mannered Geography teacher turned rabid anti EV guy.

Not all fact , but the bit about Rolls Royce certainly seems like a fact.

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

There is a small niche market for electric power in general aviation (light aircraft) e.g. for flight training carried out close to a home airfield. Not sure whether that exists solely on merit or whether it's helped by grants/subsidies, but it's what RR appeared to be focused on. Just under 2 years ago they took the world speed record for electric powered flight (well, they paid for it anyway):

Electric-powered flight records smashed - worth a watch (and with a Mercedes-Benz link ...) | OT (OFF Topic) Forums

Interesting and well-made video ... well worth a watch despite not being in HD (why??!!). Need to bear in mind that the aeroplane is in fact an 'off the shelf' American airframe - it's a Nemesis NXT racer designed for a flat 6 Lycoming engine (hence the flat/wide nose). The registration...

forums.mbclub.co.uk

Presumably they've had a hard look and decided there's not enough potential profit there. And as the man said, flying cargo or passengers across the Atlantic is never going to happen with current (or near future) technology.
As an aside I've designed/built/flown radio controlled model aircraft since 1975, and switched entirely from IC to electric power for those almost 20 years ago

 

[ChipChop]

Talking of "They" how long before the likes of Blackrock drop the ball on being ever so concerned about all matters related to ESG (environmental, social & corporate governance)?

The likely primary driver for the push towards "sustainability" currently being inflicted on western economies.

 

[Petrol Pete]

It's not a ball...it's a very hot potato.

 

[Deleted member 55947]

I'm certainly not convinced that EV's are the saviours of transport as we know it. It didn't take a genius to work out that air travel was never going to go electric, anybody with O level physics can do that!
I have not been railroaded into EV's, but my circumstances have aligned with the effort of manufactures to pay attention to the EV concept. The reasons I have an EV are:

• My wife thought the BMW was a fun and acceptable car to have.
• I have liked carbon construction cars since I first started to see their benefits in motorsport 40 years ago.
• I have surplus electrical solar energy from the Eco home I moved to 3 years ago.
• I have a nationalistic frugality streak (....ducks and takes cover from national generalisations....)
• August 2022 seemed to be the time that the prices of i3's stopped the free fall of the previous 10 months.
• I own a very nice 'long range' car in the Macan.
• The low centre of gravity and instant access to huge torque makes the car genuinely fun to drive.

I understand that these facts will not align with everyone.

A perfect summary of the EV debate.
If it ticks enough boxes for you then get one if it doesn’t then don’t.
Why oh why can’t people accept this instead of trying to tick your boxes for you

 

[markjay]

Talking of "They" how long before the likes of Blackrock drop the ball on being ever so concerned about all matters related to ESG (environmental, social & corporate governance)?

The likely primary driver for the push towards "sustainability" currently being inflicted on western economies.

Isn't Blackrock American? Not sure how they affect us here in the UK.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Talking of "They" how long before the likes of Blackrock drop the ball on being ever so concerned about all matters related to ESG (environmental, social & corporate governance)?
The likely primary driver for the push towards "sustainability" currently being inflicted on western economies.

BlackRock is a $10 trillion investor because it provides services that people want.

It's invested in ESG because of its clients. And, like most Investment Managers it's discreetly slowing down - gently - because investors are cooling, after a three fold increase these last couple of years. (It was about $100 billion globally last year)

It's voters and investors that drive governments and investment firms - from smoking to climate change. And, as with smoking, it costs investors money if they avoid easy returns, like the tobacco industry.

 

[philnewmerc]

You have been ticketed for exceeding an average speed limit? If so what was the limit and your speed?

AFAIK all cameras are 'on' nowadays (they can't run out of film any more), but as above I suspect they may sometimes be set to a higher than normal trigger threshold particularly when a 70 limit applies.

I never knowingly speed in 20 or 30 zones. In fact if there's cars on both side I go much slower. If 50+ areas where i (ok i admit in my arrogance) i speed as i have a fast car that makes me smile. But i always have a speed camera app monitoring and slow down for them - i slow down wherever I see potential dangers tbf

However, I've always drove through those motorway speed cameras at well over 80 and never had a ticket.

A lot of those speed limits on motorways dont have the red ring around them..(often just 4 yellow lights or nothing at all). No red ring means its purely advisory and cannot be inforced. It seems that only about 10 percent of people know that from the looks I get doing 70 on a clear still day with light traffic......when for some inexplicable reason 40 or 50 mph signs are showing. I'm sure sometimes they just forget to turn them off after an incident has been cleared. I stick religiously to the limits in red rings though.....not had any speeding points since 1989...I'd like to keep it that way!

Great point, I hope it is correct!

Nothing I said can be construed as alleging prosecution is "unfair."

My point, repeated a dozen times, is that the prosecution is a random process, with the police deliberately not prosecuting, despite the existence of the technology.

I'm more than happy for the police to prosecute and ban anyone doing more than 20 on an urban road, 30 on a road with street lamps and 70mph nationally.

Speeding kills.

Better still publicise the names and photos of everyone involved in a collision, regardless of "guilt." (It takes two)

And charge everyone the actual cost of going to A&E after an RTC, regardless of "guilt."

Heck, why not put speed limiters in all vehicles to stop them exceeding 70mph under all circumstances, and lower speed limits according to local signage. We know the EU is planning it. Why not use that ISA technology now ?

.Why not have black boxes in all cars and motorcycles now?

Intelligent Speed Adaptation (ISA).

Are you serious? Some 30 zones are very unsafe at 30 and should be 15. Some fast roads are safe at 100 if there's no traffic. Main unsafe drivers imho are the unthinking ones who will drive at 30 in built up areas with double parked cars and 65 on deserted motorways, oh and Audi/Vauxhall Muppets who are too important to care about anyone except their next client meeting.

 

[SgtSlow]

Speed limits (and all laws and regulations) exist only because pis-taking idiots do.

I tend to ignore them, and drive at speeds which I deem appropriate.

Past a school at the kicking out time, probably way under the posted limit. Empty stretch of M6 on a warm and dry summer night… well, I’ll leave that to your imaginations, have

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I never knowingly speed in 20 or 30 zones. In fact if there's cars on both side I go much slower. If 50+ areas where i (ok i admit in my arrogance) i speed as i have a fast car that makes me smile. But i always have a speed camera app monitoring and slow down for them - i slow down wherever I see potential dangers tbf

However, I've always drove through those motorway speed cameras at well over 80 and never had a ticket.




Great point, I hope it is correct!



Are you serious? Some 30 zones are very unsafe at 30 and should be 15. Some fast roads are safe at 100 if there's no traffic. Main unsafe drivers imho are the unthinking ones who will drive at 30 in built up areas with double parked cars and 65 on deserted motorways, oh and Audi/Vauxhall Muppets who are too important to care about anyone except their next client meeting.

Yes I’m serious.

As I said 30 is a speed limit, not the recommended speed. Obviously you drive safely within that limit. You judge whether they’ll be pedestrians, horses or parked cars round the next bend.

Outside of the Isle of Man, no national government believes that 100 is safe on ordinary roads let alone motorways. Germany is famous for its
small stretch of motorways with richgeschwindigkeit but their drivers take their driving very seriously, so usually live to tell the tale

Two drivers doing 100 mph on a single carriageway approach one another at a combined speed of 200 miles an hour. That’s not a safe impact speed on a road that seemed to be “empty” a minute before - when the two vehicles were three miles apart.

We know who the unsafe drivers are. They’re the ones with high annual insurance premiums, bans, and memories of the day when their passenger died, or when they hit that kid who crossed a road, or drove through school gates into a crowded schoolyard at 15mph because she was distracted when her SUV hit that enormous pot hole in the road

 

[Wombat457]

SO far as I am concerned - this EV rubbish is exactly that - rubbish! People jumping up and down (politicians mainly) trying to convince us that getting rid of petroleum vehicles will save the planet blah blah blah. Fact, this is all designed to put money into the pockets of the likes of Musk and the automotive industry and nopthing more.

They want to make everyone drive an ev thing by year XXXX - hmm, and who is going to force us to buy the things? Are governments going to reimburse us for the money we forked out to buy our current vehicles? NO! Oh and when are these same hypocrits going to force other areas to go EV, you know such as Trucks (all trucks) Buses, Trains (yeah - I can just see govs forking out to electrify rail routes nation wide, especially in the US, Europe and Australia lol); then there are planes and ships and what gov is going to do away with all of its military assets just to appease a handful of greenies and corporate theives? Then of course there are the dumb things like generators, weed eaters, motor mowers etc etc etc. Sure some of them exist but are in the minority because of the price of batteries etc. Speaking of which - mosdt countries are incapable of maintaining a 100% reliable electric grid NOW - imagine the kaos when electricity is the B al and End All of everything??? Emergency vehicles stranded on the side of the road with people dying all around them because the power grid failed because some idiot driving a Telsa relied on the cars ability to drive itself and rammed a power pole!!!!

Yep, gotta love this EV rubbish idea, a whole lotta thought has gone into it all hey.

Look - if people want to produce these things then fine, let them. If people want to fork out rediculous amounts to drive them and think they are doing the world a favor than that is fine as well - their perogative BUT, when governments start trying to force people, that is another thing and what really needs to be addressed.

 

[SmartAmg]

SO far as I am concerned - this EV rubbish is exactly that - rubbish! People jumping up and down (politicians mainly) trying to convince us that getting rid of petroleum vehicles will save the planet blah blah blah. Fact, this is all designed to put money into the pockets of the likes of Musk and the automotive industry and nopthing more.

They want to make everyone drive an ev thing by year XXXX - hmm, and who is going to force us to buy the things? Are governments going to reimburse us for the money we forked out to buy our current vehicles? NO! Oh and when are these same hypocrits going to force other areas to go EV, you know such as Trucks (all trucks) Buses, Trains (yeah - I can just see govs forking out to electrify rail routes nation wide, especially in the US, Europe and Australia lol); then there are planes and ships and what gov is going to do away with all of its military assets just to appease a handful of greenies and corporate theives? Then of course there are the dumb things like generators, weed eaters, motor mowers etc etc etc. Sure some of them exist but are in the minority because of the price of batteries etc. Speaking of which - mosdt countries are incapable of maintaining a 100% reliable electric grid NOW - imagine the kaos when electricity is the B al and End All of everything??? Emergency vehicles stranded on the side of the road with people dying all around them because the power grid failed because some idiot driving a Telsa relied on the cars ability to drive itself and rammed a power pole!!!!

Yep, gotta love this EV rubbish idea, a whole lotta thought has gone into it all hey.

Look - if people want to produce these things then fine, let them. If people want to fork out rediculous amounts to drive them and think they are doing the world a favor than that is fine as well - their perogative BUT, when governments start trying to force people, that is another thing and what really needs to be addressed.

Not keen on EVs, then?

 

[Wombat457]

Not keen on EVs, then?

Not for OR against them as a means of transport for those who CHOOSE to drive them.

One of my "distant reletives" has an idiot Telsa thing and it is shocking in all respects - comfort, performance, economy etc etc etc. Personally, I wouldn't waste the money on any of them, regardless of make, when I already have three very servicable and functional means of transport. Bottom line - I AM anti being told what I have to drive and or buy, especially by some self serving politician, beaurocrat and or greedy corporate ass.

As said - if people want to buy one then go for it, it is their right, their perogative and most importantly THEIR CHOICE, choice being th eoperative word.