how long for the engine to get hot? E320CDi

[maddog]

As Television said its not the same kind of cold , i recall a group of us walking from one building to another in T shirts as it was a bright sunny day and it truly felt warm outside it was -24 c.

In all honesty i dont recall the weather causing as many problems with the vehicles as it does over here, local drivers changed their driving style very quickly and it was only the visitors or those not used to the conditions that struggled.

One night the base was shut down due to the weather conditions ie a white out which is lots of snow and high winds, visability was down to a few feet. One of my friends as a joke tried to order a pizza which duly arrived driven by the unflustered delivery boy.

We were very impressed

 

[television]

maddog[/LEFT];467607]I spent a year working in Labrador, Northern Canada.

Temps went down to -40 (c) in winter and as low as -93 with the wind chill factor , whilst we

didnt​

use blinds on the radiators but we did need to plug the cars in if you parked , this used to power a small heater around the battery, in the sump and in the interior.

Large vehicles needed to parked indoors , diesels were very rare most things ran on petrol and in the extreme cold even they could have problems.


If you did switch something off in the cold like i did once , you ran the risk of not being able to start it , i recall having the starter motor freeze to the flywheel once it took less than 5 minutes for that to happen

Sweden sits on the same lines as North Canada, In the 12 years or so that I was there it only hit the -50c 3 times and then only for a couple of days, the normal cold weather touching -25c, interestingly this was in the south by the racing circuit at

​

Gislaved on the same level as the top of Scotland.

My first trip was when it hit a freak -50c I was driving a UK CX Safari that behaved impeccably, I had leather soled shoes and could not get out of the car until I bought some proper boots as salt does not work at these temps.
I would rather be there at -10c than here at 0c

 

[glojo]

As Television said its not the same kind of cold , i recall a group of us walking from one building to another in T shirts as it was a bright sunny day and it truly felt warm outside it was -24 c.

We actually saw footage of ice forming on the eyelids of drivers that ventured outside in some of the more adverse conditions, beards containing ice that had formed on the condensation plus the legs of the trailers were freezing in position, they were also having extreme difficulty attempting to disconnect trailers. It would be easy to critiucise them for doing something wrong, but seeing as this was a multi-million dollar exercise which takes place yearly, I can only assume they have might possibkly know what they are doing and using the best equipment??

REgards
John

 

[maddog]

We actually saw footage of ice forming on the eyelids of drivers that ventured outside in some of the more adverse conditions, beards containing ice that had formed on the condensation plus the legs of the trailers were freezing in position, they were also having extreme difficulty attempting to disconnect trailers. It would be easy to critiucise them for doing something wrong, but seeing as this was a multi-million dollar exercise which takes place yearly, I can only assume they have might possibkly know what they are doing and using the best equipment??

REgards
John

I cant imagine having to work in those conditions for long , as i said temps in the -20's were regular and not unusual the -90's was exceptional and freak conditions.

We had excellent equipment (military) but even so below -40 (with the wind chill) it hurts to breathe in and physical activity is very difficult , you really dont want to be outside for long. I've never had a beard but had my eyelashes frozen and more often the hairs inside your nostrils would freeze.

This was a usual day in the office

 

[glojo]

Here's a picture from the actual program. This truck is\was driving over the frozen lakes.

Note the radiator grill is completely covered

 

[television]

Here's a picture from the actual program. This truck is\was driving over the frozen lakes.

Note the radiator grill is completely covered

A common sight in Sweden in the Winter is little old ladies with a sail fitted to a shopping trolley going at high speed across the lakes. I will never forget that

 

[124fan]

When I started driving in 1977 I was told about blanking off at least half the rad in cold weather 5C or below and I've always done this. It helps with the cab heat for whatever reasons and I've never had a problem with overheating the coolant. This week I've had a folded plastic animal feed bag behind the grill in the C250td and it will remain until temps start to climb much above 5 or 6C.

Cheers

 

[glojo]

When I started driving in 1977 I was told about blanking off at least half the rad in cold weather 5C or below and I've always done this. It helps with the cab heat for whatever reasons and I've never had a problem with overheating the coolant. This week I've had a folded plastic animal feed bag behind the grill in the C250td and it will remain until temps start to climb much above 5 or 6C.

Cheers

I cannot see the harm, but are you suggesting your heating system would not work unless you done this?

Water gets hot, thermostat opens, water goes through radiator.

The bottom line is the water gets hot before the radiator comes into play so does this effect the time it takes for the engine to get warm\hot when the radiator is not coming into play?

Please note this is a question.

I thought that blanking off a radiator was done in extreme conditions where the engine coiuld not maintain an efficient operating temperature??

regards
John

 

[124fan]

This could, and probably will be discussed until the cows come home...but if you try it you'll see a marked improvement in the cab heat, I don't know the physics, at seventeen all I wanted was more heat in the cold weather, I got it and I still do this today. Just my 2p worth, for what its worth.

Cheers



EDIT: I'm guessing that the system is taking longer to get up to temp and in really cold weather or shortish runs may not get there due to the wind chill effect and by blocking off the rad / engine bay from the wind the system can get up to temp and keep it there easier.

 

[glojo]

EDIT: I'm guessing that the system is taking longer to get up to temp and in really cold weather or shortish runs may not get there due to the wind chill effect and by blocking off the rad / engine bay from the wind the system can get up to temp and keep it there easier.

Your right about the cold weather but don't forget the radiator does not come into play until both engine and water are hot. If the water doesn't get hot then the blocked off radiator is not being used.

On the series Ice Road Truckers we actually witness the overheating alarms going off because the radiator has been blanked off and this was in temperatures that are NEVER experienced in this country. I am not against blanking off radiators and each to their own, but I just like getting things clear in my head about the pro's and con's of doing something.

It would be more beneficial to try to avoid using the demister\heater fan until the engine gets hot as this extracts heat from the system, likewise if a car is overheating in a traffic jam, put the heater\demister on hoit and the fan at its highest setting to help dissipate heat from the system. This is only said to highlight how we can influence temperatures.

A diesel engine is usually a heavy beast which will take longer to get to operating temperature and you canna change the laws of fizziik's

Regards
John

 

[124fan]

I am not against blanking off radiators and each to their own, but I just like getting things clear in my head about the pro's and con's of doing something.

Me too and I drove for many miles with one eye on the temp just incase!

It would be more beneficial to try to avoid using the demister\heater fan until the engine gets hot as this extracts heat from the system, likewise if a car is overheating in a traffic jam, put the heater\demister on hoit and the fan at its highest setting to help dissipate heat from the system. This is only said to highlight how we can influence temperatures.

Agreed...and sort of shows that the system can be influenced by minor adjustments, one being the point you just made, and another a cover over the rad/engine bay.

A diesel engine is usually a heavy beast which will take longer to get to operating temperature and you canna change the laws of fizziik's

Agreed....but if the wind chill factor is reduced, then the engine block gets up to temp that much quicker and is kept there that much easier. I think that its the fact that its the rad that is covered that causes the confusion, perhaps its just the effect it has on sheltering the engine from the cold wind.

Cheers

 

[124fan]

Just another thing that comes to mind...the old chap that told me about this, (my Grandad) used to also put a large piece of cardboard in front of the rad/engine bay and another on top of the engine as insulation while his car was in the garage over night! He said that one layer of newspaper kept out 1C of frost? Again I don't no the physics, but to each his own! He never had a breakdown, and was famed in the area at the way he kept his cars

Cheers

 

[Rory]

Water gets hot, thermostat opens, water goes through radiator.

The bottom line is the water gets hot before the radiator comes into play so does this effect the time it takes for the engine to get warm\hot when the radiator is not coming into play?

I don't know the MB setup, but some engines do still allow some flow through the rad even when the 'stat is closed.

 

[glojo]

Just another thing that comes to mind...the old chap that told me about this, (my Grandad) used to also put a large piece of cardboard in front of the rad/engine bay and another on top of the engine as insulation while his car was in the garage over night! He said that one layer of newspaper kept out 1C of frost? Again I don't no the physics, but to each his own! He never had a breakdown, and was famed in the area at the way he kept his cars

Cheers

I can understand that.

Regards
John

 

[television]

Your right about the cold weather but don't forget the radiator does not come into play until both engine and water are hot. If the water doesn't get hot then the blocked off radiator is not being used.

On the series Ice Road Truckers we actually witness the overheating alarms going off because the radiator has been blanked off and this was in temperatures that are NEVER experienced in this country. I am not against blanking off radiators and each to their own, but I just like getting things clear in my head about the pro's and con's of doing something.

It would be more beneficial to try to avoid using the demister\heater fan until the engine gets hot as this extracts heat from the system, likewise if a car is overheating in a traffic jam, put the heater\demister on hoit and the fan at its highest setting to help dissipate heat from the system. This is only said to highlight how we can influence temperatures.

A diesel engine is usually a heavy beast which will take longer to get to operating temperature and you canna change the laws of fizziik's

Regards
John

John you completely miss the point on moving air, you say that it does not matter about blanking off the rad as the water thermostat has not opened, once it does, if the rad is at the same temp as the air rushing through it,say -5c, then the thermostat closes again and you have no heat in the engine or the car and you are back to square one as the ice cold water cools it down.

People completely miss this point on insulation in a house, it is the moving air that takes the heat out, when the air moves it takes the heat with it. you can sit by a fire with your front burning hot, yet with a draft from the rear your back can be frozen, and this is what its all about.

Your point on fizziik's,
A diesel engine is usually a heavy beast which will take longer to get to operating temperature and you canna change the laws of fizziik's

You can help the laws of fizziks when you understand how they work, and as they take longer to heat up why not help it to, by stopping the ice cold air from cooling down everything that you are trying to heat up.

If you are driving at 50 mph then you have a wind chill factor of a min of that temp. By stopping this cold air from coming in then everything has a chance to get to the most efficient working temp,even in winter.

You can prove this quite simply by taking a hot coffee outside when it is windy and when its not, when there is no wind but -2c I can smoke a small cigar before my coffee is cool enough to drink, when that east wind blows, my coffee is cold before I have smoked ½ of my cigar.

And I do know that you do not smoke small cigars

 

[glojo]

This is quite funny in a silly sort of way,
Where do you blank the radiator on a very modern Mercedes? We can discuss this for as long as you want but it is not straight forwartdto blank tyhe radiator on our modern vehicles is not the easiest of places to get to and masking off the front of the car is not the same thing so please tell me how you and others do this?
John

 

[television]

This is quite funny in a silly sort of way,
Where do you blank the radiator on a very modern Mercedes? We can discuss this for as long as you want but it is not straight forwartdto blank tyhe radiator on our modern vehicles is not the easiest of places to get to and masking off the front of the car is not the same thing so please tell me how you and others do this?
John

Absolutely correct, it was right back in the start of this thread that I said that modern car design has dictated the issue here.

I could do something on my 230 by removing the grill, but that is stupid, it was easy on the 123-4 and could be easy on the 202,140, 210, but I do not truthfully know. I could do it on my V70R but not on the new ones.

On the 123 series you could buy an MB rad blind that clipped onto the out side that unrolled, and it had straps to tie the rolls with, but as you say no one would be seen dead driving like that these days.


Where does this leave the thread, do it if you can or want to.

 

[124fan]

Not meaning to draw this out any further than necessary but pics of my car with rad cover...

Looking up and in...

Looking from straight in....

Hope that helps...

Cheers

 

[television]

Thats great and I thought it could be done on a 210, thats what I had on my 124 but I sprayed my cardboard black

 

[124fan]

And in a very modern Mercedes there's plenty of room in there...

A nice piece of that plastic cardboard that they make signs from would fit in there nice and tidy if found in a dark colour especially!


Cheers